# Windows 7 Versus Windows 8

Category: Geeks r Us

## Post 1 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Monday, 19-May-2014 2:55:32

I considered posting this in Safe Haven, but hopefully, we're all adults here and can act as such. I would really like to stay on topic this time, and to get some straight answers. So if you can't discuss these operating systems without sarcasm or insult, please don't post.
I am very much interested in a laptop. Namely, the Asus 1015E.
http://www.asus.com/Notebooks_Ultrabooks/1015E/
http://liliputing.com/2013/05/asus-1015e-low-cost-mini-notebook-review.html
These came out last year and are quite fast for their size and weight. Most of them have Windows 8 on them, but I found one with Windows 7. The problem is that it's in Canada, and could take anywhere from one to two weeks to reach me! I need to decide whether it's worth the wait or whether I should try Windows 8. There are three of the ones with 7 available as I write this, all from the same seller.
I found a two-part series on Windows 8, but from 2011, and to be honest, it was quite informal and chatty. I'm interested in opinions, but mostly in facts. I looked, but couldn't really find anything else from the blind perspective, except specifics on how to use various screen readers with the system. I have used 7, so am aware of some of the features that 8 has. But I have also heard that it's a sharp departure from 7 in many ways. I must explain something before continuing. It may seem irrelevant, but I think it's quite important, so please bare with me. As many of you know, I have been totally blind since I was two-months-old. Whether for this or another reason, my mind does not work spacially. That is, I very rarely imagine the layout of things, unless it's something like a room which I need to learn, or things on the table in front of me. So when I am on the computer, I don't imagine what the screen is like. But this is how I invision XP, and 7 for that matter. The start menu, all programs menu, system tray, and notifications are all vertical. Of course, each shows different things, and the all programs menu is an expantion of the start menu, with its own submenus, just as accessories is an expantion of that, though in its own submenu. When in a program, such as Wordpad, each menu is accessed with the alt key and is vertical, except that they are arranged in columns. In this example, they are file, edit, view, insert, format, help, and system. The desktop, and folders in general, are like grids, where you can move not only vertically, but horizontally as well.
From what I have heard, Windows 8 is very different, with things like containers, which were explained as boxes within boxes. I'm imagining that these are like the start, all programs, and accessories menus. Some programs are called metro apps and are never closed. Did they include some kind of switcher for them, and can NVDA now properly read the metro task manager? ? There is also the regular task manager, with normal programs. Then, there are ribbons. I do not understand these at all, and found them extremely annoying in Wordpad and Notepad in 7. So much so that I downgraded to their Vista equivalents. But what, exactly, are they, and are they useful and usable to screen reader users? I have heard that there is a way to turn them off. If this is done, how do programs look, considering that they don't have the menus, as in my Wordpad example? I have also heard that metro apps can be turned off. What does this do to the appearance of the screen for us? Does it basically become a giant desktop or start menu? What are tiles and charms?
I heard of Windows 8.1. How does this differ from 8 and is it easy to upgrade? How well does NVDA and System Access work with 8 and 8.1? Can I still use XP and 7 compatible programs with 8 and 8.1? Is 8 really touch-oriented, as many have said, and if so, is 8.1 less so, as I have also heard?
Having asked all of that, given the fact that I have used XP and 7, would you recommend 8 for me, or do you think it would be too confusing? Finally, if I did get a machine with 8, could I easily downgrade or run 7 in a virtual environment? If so, which program would you recommend for that?
I'm sorry for the numerous questions, but I figured it was better to ask everything at once and see who answers what, so that I could decide more quickly. Thanks for all the help.

## Post 2 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Monday, 19-May-2014 21:14:57

You could get the 7 computer and that would serve you well for 5 years. As far as upgrading from 8 ... I didn't find it difficult to to get to 8.1 but I was using jaws too. The start menu or screen as it is called in 8.1 do look totally different. I an only speak to the use with jaws. Like 7 , you can search for things in the start screen. when you go to the start screen, just start typing and it'll pop up with p program results first, f f f f followed by files from your drives, followed by web search re results which by default uses bing.
I see nothing wrong with either OS. but here's what I did personally. I st stuck with 7 for all my devices. I just upgraded from XP to 7, and I'd rather stick with one o operating system. You've used 7 before, and I think you'd be fine getting a box w with 7 on it. Support for windows 7 doesn't end Until January 2020. I've helped others on the zone get boxes with 7 on it too.

## Post 3 by forereel (Just posting.) on Monday, 19-May-2014 21:30:00

There are several boards on the difference here. Also Domestic Goddess has a board where we discuss Windows 8 lots.
Maybe read these boards.
We discussed Windows 7 on your board problems with Windows 7 as well. Maybe read back through that one.
My opinion is that Windows 7 and Windows 8 have no good or bad about them for a blind user, due to us using exactly the things you talked about in how you imagine the systems to work.
You can use all of this with 8.
It is not suggested to keep a system running 8, but you should get all upgrades available for the OS. These are like service patches and are important to the operation and security or the OS.

## Post 4 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Monday, 19-May-2014 21:38:52

Thanks for the suggestion. I'll check those posts. Despite the title, this was really more of a comparison between 7 and 8, with attention to 8, since, as you said, I have used 7. I just didn't want to buy a machine and completely regret it.

## Post 5 by forereel (Just posting.) on Monday, 19-May-2014 21:43:33

I have said this before. If you decide somethings going to be hard to learn, and is difficult before you see it, that thing will be difficult.
If you approach it with an open mind, understanding it will be slightly different, but much the same, you'll do fine.

## Post 6 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Monday, 19-May-2014 21:54:41

I don't think either one will be all that difficult. However since you already know 7 there's nothing wrong with sticking to that either.

## Post 7 by forereel (Just posting.) on Monday, 19-May-2014 22:02:47

8 runs better on lower powered machines than 7, but if you don't have them to compare? Smile.

## Post 8 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 13:48:30

I never thought of this before, but my explorations of Linux have led me to this conclusion. It's just as silly as the people who buy a product because it's $1.99 instead of $2, but it's true. I think one of my issues with all these changes with Windows is that they're still calling it Windows! I started with 95, and of course, most of my time has been spent using XP. But between 95, 98, XP, and even 7, the basics were still the same. Start menu, programs, desktop, and you still had to close out programs, folders, and documents when you were finished, unless you wanted to have an enormous amount of Windows open at once. Had all of these new changes been explained to me in Linux, they wouldn't have bothered me as much. There would still have been a learning curve, but I would know that it's a different operating system. I don't expect OS X or DOS to act like Windows, but I expect the next varient of Windows to be similar to its predecessors in some respects. There's just something about the idea of upgrading an operting system, and having it act like something else, that gets to me. Plus, I see no reason for it. Sure, there are bound to be changes and improvements, but the old interface works fine.
Then, there's the simple fact that I'm just nervous. What if I try it and hate it, or find it very frustrating? I doubt I can easily downgrade. I had enough annoyances with 7, though I'm giving it another chance, on my Thinkpad X60.

## Post 9 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 16:09:09

I was looking for the differences between 8 and 8.1, and some tutorials for the blind, when I found this article on those who are purposefully still using XP.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2139352/true-confessions-from-windows-xp-faithfuls-why-they-refuse-to-move-on.html
They pretty much say the same things that I do. It works and does what I want it to do. But unlike the people mentioned here, I am concerned about security, and also about my browsers going out of date. Then, of course, there's the issue of accessibility, which naturally doesn't concern those interviewed for the article. If it wasn't for those issues, I, too, would stick with XP. But I also read that Microsoft plans on returning the start menu to 8.1, and that there is a way to eliminate metro apps. So that sounds extremely promising. Then, I found this! Has anyone here used it? The description of how to do things was quite visual. How well does this program work with NVDA, System Access, and the keyboard in general? If it really does return normal functionality to my computer, then I can easily get 8, upgrade to 8.1, and not worry about it.
http://computertutorflorida.com/2013/02/make-windows-8-look-like-windows-7-or-windows-xp/
Speaking of which, how easy is it to upgrade to 8.1? I know that it's essential to do this, and wish to do it as soon as I get my new machine.

## Post 10 by forereel (Just posting.) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 18:48:30

Windows is called Windows, because that is exactly what it is.
The base interface has not changed, only the features.
When you feel your computer monitor, this is a square or rectangle shape, much like a Window on a house.
When a program is opened, that information is on your monitor in a Window/square or rectangle.
You can have several Windows on your one large Window, just like a building with lots of apartments.
Windows 8/8.1/8.1.1 are same, just that the features have been changed, and these are updates, not completely different systems.
Windows is still Windows, and for the most part can be controlled and used like Windows.
This fact is especially true for the blind, because we don’t use items on our screens as points of locating things, we use key strokes, or movements. Left, right up and down, to operate.
What bothers people about change is exactly this, change.
If you take away the start menu, and call it start screen this is different.
The start screen had lots of things on it, and these things are also colorful. These didn’t represent programs, but apps. This has been changed.
However, we as blind persons can’t see this, so we use Windows exactly the same way. We only need to learn that things are gotten to in a different control fashion.
Example.
Instead of directly moving up and down, seeing our main programs, such as XP, we now need to press our Windows key. This puts us on the start screen. We now just see the apps, but if we control tab we will see a list of things we can use if we arrow down.
The first group are the Windows 8 apps, but continuing on down, we soon come to desktop apps.
We can still place our programs on the desktop, but now we have the added feature of typing that program name in our search box “Microsoft Outlook” and finding that program.
This has been a feature also in Windows Vista up.
So, in short, Windows has not changed, features have changed.
Our Windows now can be used on a variety of devices instead of being limited to just PC use.
Tthis has made it possible for us as blind persons to use a variety of devices we had no access to before.
Just my thoughts.

## Post 11 by forereel (Just posting.) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 18:56:17

One other word.
Sometimes purchasing a machine that has Windows 8 on it from day one will make it difficult, or in some cases impossible to downgrade, due to the company not providing drivers for the machine for the earlier version of Windows.

## Post 12 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:02:59

This is exactly the kind of thing that I was hoping for in both my Google searches and this thread! Thank you for the examples of how things are done in 8 and 8.1. If the apps can be hidden, we can just get to the regular programs, and I've heard that 8.1 has a way to boot directly into the desktop. What about searching? I noticed, with 7, that not all of my files were showing up when I set various criteria, even though I knew that certain files contained the given word or phrase. Also, I was unable to set specific criteria, as I could in XP. Has this been resolved, and is there a way to just search for things in the computer, without including the internet, social networks, and so on?

## Post 13 by forereel (Just posting.) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:04:50

Yes.

## Post 14 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:21:02

The feature you want is called "Boot directly to desktop"
however. let me explain something.
If you get a non-touch device, Windows 8.1 will realize this is a non-touch device and will keep you in the desktop mode.
It is possible to uninstall the modern apps and just keep the desktop ones.
there's also programs out there that can be installed such as ClassicShell that will let the start screen and file explorer look like the start menu as it was in xp or 7. it also will let file explorer look like the windows explorer of old.
If you really hate windows 8.1 interface that much, this is an option to try.
Yes, the start menu is coming back in some form. however what isn't known is just how MS will present it. It might not be the same as the menu in Windows 7. what is also unknown is if it'll come back in a windows 8.1 update 2, or if they'll just wait to release windows 9 in the spring of 2015 to put the start menu or whatever they'll call it back.

## Post 15 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:28:21

So it sounds as if my problems have been solved! Excellent! Now, I can get that machine and not worry, and it's only $185 with free shipping! If that one is no longer available, the next price is still under $250.

## Post 16 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:29:52

are you seriously getting windows 8 tiff?

## Post 17 by forereel (Just posting.) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:47:10

Start menu is still here John.
You can select how you want the system to start.
If you install Windows 8 on a PC it chooses desktop mode, if not start. It is a really simple change.
Personally for a blind user, I don't really see it makes me a difference.
If I want to get on my desktop I press the Windows key and letter M.
Start screen, windows key. No big deal.

## Post 18 by forereel (Just posting.) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:48:04

Start screen I meant.
I even use my start screen often.

## Post 19 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:48:16

Hi,
Just wanted to echo some of your concerns here. Windows 8 is not very different for a blind user. There are apps, which is located in a folder, and other programs too. If you get tired of the apps, however, you can remove them as others have indicated here. Additionally, Classic Shell is a great piece of software; it basically eliminates the Windows 8 interface; however, you still have an option to switch between the traditional Start Menu you are used to and the start screen. I use Classic Shell all the time and love it. NVDA performs okay, but I'm not an avid user.
Either operating system will do well, but Windows 8 is designed for lower power hardware, so if the machines aren't very powerful, as I doubt they are for this price, you will want Windows 8. If you can't tolerate Windows 8, get 7, but note that your operations may be a little slower.
Nathan.

## Post 20 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:48:56

well if on a pc with a touch s screen it would choos the app interface, but it is easy to get to desktop mode too. i like the new file explorer also.

## Post 21 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:50:38

actually before she ditch that 8, i'd try upgrading to 8.1 first to see if she likes that any better. next i'd try ClassicShell. if you really h hate all those that much, then i'd go back to a 7 device.

## Post 22 by forereel (Just posting.) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 19:54:49

If she doesn't upgrade as I've pointed out, she will miss out on updates. If you are going to run Windows 8, you need the latest version, or you harm yourself.
Doesn't make sense.

## Post 23 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 20:03:04

Hi,
I would recommend that you stay away from this machine!!!
Let me explain something to you:
This laptop is using a Cellaron CPU or processor, and the speed is only 1.1 GHZ. Now, this isn't even a core 2 duo machine, which would run your programs a lot faster as well as Jaws. Since you are getting a Cellaron, Jaws will run or NVDA, but response time will be dramatically slow. Example.
I was interested in a home theater PC. I bought the Asus Vivo PC VM40 with a 1.6 GHZ cellaron. Now, this computer had 4 GB of ram and a 500 GB hard drive. It ran so slow that when I tried to run Pandora, browse the Internet, and have a virus scan in the background, Pandora only played once and completely stopped. You will regret this purchase, no matter what operating system you have. I hope you have not bought it yet because you have wasted your money. I'm not trying to insult you, but give you simple facts. For a machine to run decently, you need at least a one core processor that is powerful, but for best results, you should have a core 2 Duo. For $185.00, I would sell you a Dell Inspiron, loaded with Jaws, demo, but I could install NVDA, four USB ports, one eithernet jack, one modem jack, one VDA connection, one FireWire Port, CD/DVD drive, and SD card reader. The battery is decent, and I have gotten over 2 ours with it so far. Would even replace battery for you and give you two extended high capacity 9-cell batteries.
Specifications:
Dell Inspiron 1420; Look it up on Amazon.com
Here they are:
Processor: Intel core 2 Duo 2.00 GHZ, 2,000 MHZ, 4 GB of ram installed, max; Windows 7 Pro, Office 07, IE 11, Security Essentials, four USB 2.0 ports, built-in fast WI-FI, either net card, modem. Has been refurbished by me, and it is in great physical and cosmetic condition. Had audio issue, but this is now fixed. Let me know what you want to do. Don't buy this!!!

## Post 24 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 20:09:46

you'll d do better with what nason is offering you.
I didn't seeh the specs on the box you are considering, but ce cellerin is utter shit.

## Post 25 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 20:57:41

Just a glance at the specs made me laugh, not because it's not a good machine, but because of the weight and size. It weighs 4.4 lbs. with the four cell battery, and has a 14 inch screen. I have an HP Elitebook 2520P if I want something like that.
http://h20565.www2.hp.com/portal/site/hpsc/template.PAGE/public/kb/docDisplay?javax.portlet.begCacheTok=com.vignette.cachetoken&javax.portlet.endCacheTok=com.vignette.cachetoken&javax.portlet.prp_ba847bafb2a2d782fcbb0710b053ce01=wsrp-navigationalState%3DdocId%253Demr_na-c02068853-1%257CdocLocale%253D%257CcalledBy%253D&javax.portlet.tpst=ba847bafb2a2d782fcbb0710b053ce01&ac.admitted=1400632944030.876444892.492883150
Here are the specifications for the Asus.
http://www.asus.com/Notebooks_Ultrabooks/1015E/
Every single review that I read of it said that it handles prorams nicely, including Youtube. I have used two netbooks. The Acer Aspire One AOA150 and the Aspire One D255, respectively. I never had any problems with them when it came to speed. They each had only 1gb of ram and were far older than this Asus, which is supposed to be at least three times faster than a netbook. The processor is dual core, at 1.1ghz, which means 2.2ghz in total, and 8 is supposed to be able to handle these sorts of systems better than 7, from what I'm reading here. As for antivirus, that always slows things down, so I certainly wouldn't be listening to music online and and browsing the net while one of those was running.
At any rate, I found the Asus on Amazon for $200, plus $6 for shipping, and bought it. The seller used it for one day, hated Windows 8, and then got a 7 machine. At this price, I doubt I'll be crying. If nothing else, I have my Thinkpad X60 with 7 on it, so if this new one is as bad as everyone is saying, I could easily sell it. We'll see.

## Post 26 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 21:13:56

I wouldn't have baught it. i try to stear anyone away from anything less than a Core I3 processor. Even the 3rd gen core I3 (which i currently am writing this on) is better than that celleron.
however, its awesome that you are trying windows 8.exe. Maybe this pc will work well for you. If not, somebody will buy it.
I hope you got the model with 4 GB of ram.

## Post 27 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 22:48:42

No. I couldn't find those anywhere. But both my Thinkpad and my Elitebook have 4gb. I don't think my Elitebook has the kind of processor you mentioned, though I could be wrong. But it was extremely fast with 7.

## Post 28 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Tuesday, 20-May-2014 22:50:56

I've found that 2 GB just isn't enough with 7.
I have 4 GB on my dell laptop and that works pretty nice. the processor on that is pretty old though.

## Post 29 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Wednesday, 21-May-2014 7:57:00

Even with the older dell desktops, they still run nicely. Example. I'm typing this on a 1420 Inspiron. It's at least from 2008 or 2010. It's great.

## Post 30 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Wednesday, 21-May-2014 7:58:31

Oh, and the specs for this machine did not say it was core 2 Duo, so wherever you found that, that is incorrect.

## Post 31 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 21-May-2014 13:27:45

A quick search brought up several references to it being a dual core machine.
https://www.google.com/search?q=asus+1015e+processor
According to Wikipedia, the processor has two cores.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_Celeron_microprocessors
"Celeron 847
SR08N (Q0)
2
1.1 GHz
N/A
2 × 256 KB
2 MB
HD Graphics (6 EUs)
350–800 MHz
17 W
BGA-1023
DMI 2.0
June 2011
AV8062700852800
$134"
Just to clarify, the Asus is coming with Windows 8 and not 7 on it.
But the desktop that I want to get will be the most powerful machine that I've ever owned.
http://h20566.www2.hp.com/portal/site/hpsc/template.PAGE/public/kb/docDisplay/?spf_p.tpst=kbDocDisplay&spf_p.prp_kbDocDisplay=wsrp-navigationalState%3DdocId%253Demr_na-c01570344-70%257CdocLocale%253D%257CcalledBy%253D&javax.portlet.begCacheTok=com.vignette.cachetoken&javax.portlet.endCacheTok=com.vignette.cachetoken
http://h20566.www2.hp.com/portal/site/hpsc/template.PAGE/public/kb/docDisplay/?spf_p.tpst=kbDocDisplay&spf_p.prp_kbDocDisplay=wsrp-navigationalState%3DdocId%253Demr_na-c01570345-15%257CdocLocale%253Den_US%257CcalledBy%253D&javax.portlet.begCacheTok=com.vignette.cachetoken&javax.portlet.endCacheTok=com.vignette.cachetoken
As you can tell, there are many processor configurations. I've seen several, on Ebay, that said Intel Core 2 Quad and 3ghz, with 8gb ram. I would like to get one of those. For some reason, the above links didn't say it, but there are eight usb ports, a built-in serial and an optional parallel. All in all, it has everything that I want in a desktop, provided that I can find the correct configuration!

## Post 32 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 21-May-2014 18:42:21

I just saw this and am really impressed.
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/keyboard-shortcuts#keyboard-shortcuts=windows-8
I like hotkeys for things, instead of tabbing around, opening and closing menus, dealing with buttons and graphics, etc. Even the menus here seem to be the kind I like, where I just hit right arrow to open things and left arrow to close them. I think Windows 8.1 and I are going to get along quite well. Now where is my machine! haha Seriously, though, I hope it goes as well as I'm imagining. But it does seem that they put a lot of effort into accessibility, or at least, a lot for Microsoft, and that many things can easily be done by remembering various key combinations. But I do need to know how to find the wireless connection setting, so that I can get online, and how to upgrade to 8.1.

## Post 33 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 21-May-2014 18:58:20

I just found this list of commands for Narrator. While I won't be using it as my main screen reader, I would like to see what improvements have been made since XP and 7, and I will need it to start NVDA in any case.
http://tink.co.uk/2012/07/useful-windows-8-narrator-commands/

## Post 34 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 21-May-2014 20:52:26

I wouldn't get anything less than a core 2 duo on that first one if you insist on it.
the processors are old. Is this a 32-bit board or 64-bit board?
if 32, don't get more than 4 GB of ram. DDR 2? that's old ram too.

## Post 35 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 21-May-2014 21:02:55

I would imagine it's 64bit, or it wouldn't make sense for it to come with 8gb of ram. But that is a very valid point, and I will investigate.

## Post 36 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 21-May-2014 21:04:46

yeah. that's my u guess too. I guess you'll find this on ebay? It seems to me that HP ke keeps any older products spec sheets online

## Post 37 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 21-May-2014 21:52:18

Yes. It does come in a 64-bit configuration, as verified by several sites, including HP.
https://www.google.com/search?q=dc7900+64-bit&oq=dc7900+64-bit&gs_l=serp.12..0i30.106138.106138.0.109094.1.1.0.0.0.0.294.294.2-1.1.0....0...1c..44.serp..0.1.290.eLB3ITygQi4

## Post 38 by forereel (Just posting.) on Thursday, 22-May-2014 1:23:02

The processor will due, just will be slow.
2GB works well with 7.

## Post 39 by forereel (Just posting.) on Thursday, 22-May-2014 1:33:42

Machines such as the one she's got are meant to just do your email, web browsing, so light word processing.
You aren't suppose to run to many applications at once.

## Post 40 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Thursday, 22-May-2014 3:40:43

That's pretty much all I do anyway. The heaviest programs that I use are Skype (usually through GW Connect), Samnet, Klango, Debut Video Capture, and Recordpad. Very rarely do I run more than two of those at once. If anything, I'm guilty of having many windows in Firefox and Wordpad open at the same time, but I've been getting better about that.

## Post 41 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 22-May-2014 10:36:10

hmmm, I haven't heard of any of these programs, well not the video or recordpad but now i'm curious.
I shall check those out.

## Post 42 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Thursday, 22-May-2014 12:44:08

Here you go. This is their main site. They make all sorts of things!
http://www.nchsoftware.com/
Sometimes, they will try to install other programs that they make, but no toolbars or advertisements. You can either tell them no, at the installation of the one you want, or just delete the extras later. I also use Doxilion from them, which converts between many document formats. The audio equivalent is called Switch. Everything that I've tried from NCH has been accessible and easy to understand.

## Post 43 by LeoGuardian (You mean there is something outside of this room with my computer in it?) on Thursday, 22-May-2014 13:09:30

Ok i'm just saying this, Tiffanitsa.
You get on a high horse against graphics, then talk about using your brain and so on.
But, for a keyboard user, hot keys and the voice reader telling you what a control is, is the same thing as using graphics is for a sighted person. So you can't claim to like hot keys and shortcuts while bashing graphics as inferior or less intelligent, because they amount to the same exact thing from a user perspective. Your anti-graphics stance and making it sounds like graphics makes people dumber is patently unfair to sighted users, especially then when you come out and admit you do the same thing by using accelerators or hot keys.
Which I also do as well, but I do not share you delusion and anti-sighted bias.

## Post 44 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Thursday, 22-May-2014 13:22:27

Right now, I don't use them that much. The closest I come is putting shortcuts on the desktop. I also used Auto Hotkey a few times. Usually, I do things with menus, and I should clarify by saying that, even though I fully wish to learn these hotkeys, I also want to know how to get to these things normally, incase I ever need to do so, for whatever reason. It's good to know both the shortcut and the regular way. But as I said, hotkeys are easier. As for graphics, could this also not be done with batch files and macros? When I go to the c prompt and hit wp, and WordPerfect starts up, that's not graphical, and the same holds with hitting talk to start VocalEyes, assuming that I haven't told it to start automatically via autoexec.bat. Macros also existed in the Braille Lite, and the BrailleNote has key combinations for things.

## Post 45 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 22-May-2014 22:38:20

Tiff, have you used stuff from piriform?
all their software is some of the most accessible I've ever seen, other than Speccy. for something like Speccy I'd use Belarc Advisor instead.

## Post 46 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 22-May-2014 22:38:43

http://www.piriform.com

## Post 47 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 22-May-2014 22:43:48

http://www.belarc.com/free_download.html

## Post 48 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Monday, 26-May-2014 5:55:04

Yes, that desktop will do, but you should get a core I7 Intel 4th generation instead of a quad core.
The most powerful desktop I have is the Cybertron Hellion GM1213. It has a fan controller on front to control the speed of each individual fan, a hexacore unlocked AMD FX series processor; it can be overclocked to run at a faster speed, say 4.0 GHZ; 16 GB of ram, though my graphics card is sharing some of this memory, so trying to figure out how to resolve this problem, GEForce GT640; 2 GB of memory; okay graphics card, entry level I've heard though, cool LED lights that light up, 1 TB 7200 RPM hard drive, Windows 8.1 64-bit; max memory or ram supported= 32 GB. Built-in WIFI; only $770. Not bad. Especially, for all of the features.

## Post 49 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Monday, 26-May-2014 12:03:19

I'm glad you're happy with your purchase. For me, that would be far too much to spend, and far more power, storage, and ram than I could ever need, even in a desktop!

## Post 50 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Monday, 26-May-2014 23:04:52

I agree with tiff. that's waaaay overkill even for you. lol

## Post 51 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Monday, 26-May-2014 23:13:26

please explain this to me. when the hell are you ever gonna even use half of that power? what are you doing on this box that requires so much ram and power?
Seriously, I really do wanna know.
most don't need I7's or that much ram.
most don't need 6 core either.

## Post 52 by rat (star trek rules!) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 13:33:06

It's choice to what people have in their systems, some would say mine is over powered. Core i7 quad core, 8 gb ram, 120 gb SSD primary with 2 TB storage drive.

## Post 53 by LeoGuardian (You mean there is something outside of this room with my computer in it?) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 14:16:48

Menus are graphical.
Also, what you do with your batch files is no different than what is done with an icon.
High horse is now tranche de viande or some other food product for either humans or dogs.

## Post 54 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 15:36:27

I don't mean in the sense of coding, but of how they are viewed by a person. To my knowledge, text-based menus don't have icons for clicking, using a mouse, etc.
In any case, returning to the topic at hand, my new machine will come with Windows 8 on it. Of course, I will be upgrading to 8.1. What are the steps to do this? Finally, as I said earlier, I found a link containing all of the Windows 8 hotkeys. I would like to know, prior to memorising them and to writing them down, are there any significant changes regarding these between 8 and 8.1? For example, it says that to start narrator, I would press windows-enter. But I've seen another command for it as well. I think ctrl-windows-u, but am not sure.

## Post 55 by LeoGuardian (You mean there is something outside of this room with my computer in it?) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 16:31:58

Go to your DOS sites and ask them about Mouse.com, a real-mode Mouse driver.
You could not see them, but yes, text-based menus have all kiinds of graphics and color differentiations in order to make the text distinguishable as a set of menus. Even the concept of the light bar which is more like a spotlighter, which was the way to do this in DOS was generally done.
You want reality to confirm your beliefs. Unfortunately, it does not.
There is even graphical menus and a graphical system built into Word Perfect for DOS, complete with dialog boxes. It is just hidden from you by text screen readers that did not say dialog or button.
That was just a product of the times, but doesn't change reality.
All user interfaces are symbolic in some sense. What, really, is the difference between the text:
c:wt51wp
and a menu that allows you to select Word Perfect (a common feature of DOS machines)? Or the Word Perfect icon on your desktop?
You just have made up a religion against graphics, just as some Christian sects have made up a religion against sex or what foods one can eat. It doesn't make it sensible, just a belief.
Beliefs don't belong in rational discussions of an engineering or a scientific nature.
Now, if that is your preference only, fine and have at it. But there is no bearing on one's performance because one uses one type of graphical system, e.g. Windows or Mac, or another type of graphical system, e.g. DOS / Unix.
The command line is just one aspect to your graphical system, and all systems have both a command line and a GUI.

## Post 56 by forereel (Just posting.) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 16:50:19

On the start screen. Just type
add features to windows.
You will find a link that says Add features to Microsoft Windows.
You can install this about 90%, but after the computer restarts, and it will restart several times, you won't have any speech, so will have to get someone to answer the questions as to how you want to set it up.
Extremely easy.
Once you have 8.1 installed, Microsoft will offer 8.1.1 and this is just an update.
It will not look different, just have a few options is all you don't have now.
You can read about what is added right on that website.
I'd also make sure I have the key. This should be located on a sticker on the machine.
Good luck.

## Post 57 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 16:59:21

So basically, unless I send this computer down to Lee as well, I'll be using 8. I really have no one sighted here who can do this for me. Mom is a definite no. I'll try to ask Joanie, but the odds are she'll be busy, so I'll have to keep nagging to get it done, and who knows when that will be. Maybe, if I make it sound serious enough, she'll do it, but generally, my parents don't get involved in my technology. Is there any accessible way around this, or is running 8 that bad?

## Post 58 by forereel (Just posting.) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 17:13:17

I have seen someone post they could, but they never answered the question as to how.
So, saying that, and havinging done it, I say no.
5 10 minutes of your parents time is all it requires. Like reading the mail. Smile
A few mouse clicks and you are ready.
A neighbor could do this for you as well. The person doesn't need to be anything but able to read and understand what they've read.
This is a laptop, so you can take it anyplace for this help.

## Post 59 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 18:50:41

I will probably never use that much ram, though it is nice to have extra, so I don't have to upgrade the machine. Playing HD videos is about all.

## Post 60 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 19:02:58

Ah okay. As long as it doesn't take long and is not advanced, I'm sure that she'll do it. *smile* I thought it was an involved process.

## Post 61 by starfly (99956) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 20:52:05

I have a I5 2.5 turbo boost to 3.1, 8 gigs of ram and a 500 gig harddrive. Why do I have such a system, so in 3 years I do not have to go replace a system that will crap out or may crap out. It was wurth 1125 every pinny.

## Post 62 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 21:15:53

But you were also willing to spend that much on a computer. I'm not, regardless of it's specs. No computer, in 2014, should cost that much, unless it's truly custom-made, industrial, or for huge businesses.

## Post 63 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 27-May-2014 22:38:53

I went to Google, to see if I could upgrade to 8.1 on my own, and apparently, I can. I found this at the Dolphin site. Even though I use NVDA, it should still be applicable.
http://www.yourdolphin.com/dolphin.asp?id=695&lang2=en
"Is updating to Windows 8.1 fully accessible for blind and visually impaired people using SuperNova?
Yes. SuperNova 13.52 users updating a Windows 8 x86 machine can complete this task independently. Part of the installation following the first reboot requires use of the basic Narrator screen reader launched with WINDOWSKEY+ENTER."

## Post 64 by season (the invisible soul) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 2:02:45

Tif, you so call doesn't want to spend $$$ on your computer, do you seriously think you spend less than any of us that use a well advance computer? just listen to yourself. How many computer you own, and how much in average each computer cost? Not only that, there are things that you can't see that you are spending, not just the direct $$$, but something more. The time you spend with each computer to get it work, all the google, questions, research that you do in order to get a piece of out dated equipment to work like the most up-to-date equipment etc. It is all time consuming, and all these time can be converted to $$$. Ask starfly or Leo or any of the half computer savi user here, how much we spend in time on making a thing work compare to how much time we enjoy working a thing, and using our time in other more benefitial area.

## Post 65 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 3:24:04

Most of the computers that I own I didn't buy. They were given to me over a span of many years. I don't think I have ever paid over $350 for a computer, even brand new, and that is probably a high estimate. This new one cost $206. It is also important to remember that the computers that I use on a daily basis are not that old. My Elitebook, that had Windows 7 on it, is under four-years-old, and the only actual problem with it was that the sound kept turning off. It was probably a driver's issue, but I have decided to make that a Linux machine, if, in fact, I keep it. My X60 is older, but the problems there have been fixed. The inside was very dirty, which is to be expected, given it's age. The cleaning stopped the issue where the computer was shutting off. The keyboard needed replacing, and that was done. This was entirely my fault. It is being upgraded to Windows 7 and will be shipped off this week. My desktop has issues, but even I admit that it's old and needs to be replaced.

## Post 66 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 5:13:02

I agree with Starfly on this one. Why purchase a computer for less money, when it will probably be manufactured from cheaper materials? I know that Starfly probably has a Mac, because there's no way a Windows PC would cost that much money, unless it was a very high-end gaming PC. My processor is an AMD hexacore at 3.5 GHZ, unlocked, and ready for overclocking if I so wish. This is because I had a company, Cybertron PC, build it custom for me. Actually, it was one of there pre-configured systems, meaning that I didn't add any additional components to it. Even though I purchased it from Amazon, Cybertron built it first, then ships all of the computers to Amazon to be resold. This PC is meant for gaming, but can be used as a multi-purpose machine too. That is because Amazon is a fulfillment company.
The most I've spent on a computer by myself is this one at $770; but I also spent $742 for another one. That computer which I spent $742 on still runs perfectly, and it is an HP. My mom's desktop has XP, and now there's a lady inside the machine that talks to me about how I need to click here to fix problems, a definite virus, and I won't click anywhere! My mom needs a replacement desktop, but I like my desktop, because I like to be able to sit at a desk every once in a while, instead of having something constantly on my lap. So, I decided to upgrade and get another computer. I picked out the custom configuration, so I wouldn't have to upgrade at all for a good while; maybe down the road, I might switch the primary hard drive to an "SSD and add a 2 TB in addition to the 1 TB that is currently in the computer, but that will be a while yet, because the computer meets all my needs. That might not be until Christmas before I make some upgrades.
Really, the higher-end gaming PCS only have a few things which are better than this machine: A high wattage power supply, a better graphics card, mine is a entry to mid-level, and a solid-state drive. Some are equipped with water cooling, but you don't actually need this feature unless you are putting your system through some serious gaming. So, in theory, all of these components, the power supply, with higher wattage, a better graphics card, and a SSD, might cost around $300. But, my computer is plenty capable now. Since my mom needed a new desktop, she wanted to take mine, since I'm at college. But, I want to have a desktop in my room at my apartment. So, that's why I bought a new one. I'm giving her the old HP, which I got in 2010; four-years-old, but still runs great. It's not that old.
I don't really understand what turboboost means; I think it automatically provides extra processing power when needed.
It's your money and budget though, and I hope your computer works for you well.
For me, I'll buy custom-builds from now on.
Nathan.

## Post 67 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 11:28:04

everybody hold on a second. I've done this. its easy to get windows 8.1 without sited help.
tiff, when you get the box, are you gonna have the screen reader loaded?
if not, you can load it yourself. you'll be using NVDA correct? You know how to start narrator without help right?WindowsKey+U.
Le'ts start there and i'll help you with this process. Very easy to do your updates without sited help.
I did this for my nabor without any helpd from sited folks so I'm sure this can be done.

## Post 68 by LeoGuardian (You mean there is something outside of this room with my computer in it?) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 11:42:27

Atually on Windows 8, just press window+Enter and Narrator will begin.

## Post 69 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 12:02:31

Oh see now that's an easier way yet.
anyway from there load your screne reader of choice. once that's loaded, go to the start screen and type windows update. Be sure to get all the important updates. after a long while it'll ask you to reboot.
reboot your system and go thruthe process of checking for updates all over again.
Make sure you do this until every last important update for windows 8 is installed. This is very important. If you don't install all the 8 updates first, then windows 8.1 wont show up in the windows store. You'll need to go to the store to get the update from windows 8 to windows 8.1. Why Microsoft makes you go to the store to get 8.1 is beyond me.
To get to the store, type windows store in your start screen. It should be the first thing to come up.
Once that is loaded, there should be something about updaiting to windows 8.1
This is an easy process that just involves a link that you'd hit enter on to download the update.
This will take a while so please just hold those horses.
You'll need to reboot to finish this.
Next, you'll need to go to windows update to update from windows 8.1 to windows 8.1 update.
This can also take a while, and all you need to do I s is follow the steps I outlined above for using windows update to get this.
go to the start screen and type windows update. Be sure to get all the important updates. after a long while it'll ask you to reboot.
I personally find this entire updating process to be a pain in the ass, but it can be done.

## Post 70 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 12:28:02

I agree about spending m more to get b better, so you can keep t it for a while.
My Thinkpad Ex131 E wasn't cheap.
$789.00
Processor Intel Core i3-3227U Processor (3M Cache, 1.90 GHz)
Operating System Windows 7 Home Premium 64
Operating System Language Windows 7 Home Premium 64 - English
Display Type 11.6" W HD (1366 x 768)LED, Anti-Glare, Midnight Black (w/WWAN), 720p HD Camera
System Graphics Intel GMA HD Gfx 4000, Intel Core i3-3227U ULV Processor (1.9GHz, 3MB L3, 1600MHz DDR3)
Total Memory 8 GB DDR3 - 1600MHz (2 DIMM)
Keyboard Keyboard - US English
Hard Drive 128GB Solid State Drive, 2.5"
Battery 6 Cell Lithium Battery (X131e)
Power Cord 65W AC Adapter - US (2pin)
Integrated WiFi Wireless LAN Adapters ThinkPad a/b/g/n Wireless BT Combo (2x2 ABGN & BT4.0)
This is the PAC Mate or smaller laptop as a replacement for my tr travel d device.

## Post 71 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 12:29:57

Lenovo Slim USB Portable DVD Burner
$ 79.99
ThinkPad Basic Case
-System details $ 29.00
I'll keep this until Windows 7 stopst being supported then sel the en entire thing.

## Post 72 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 12:33:02

This is the replacement I got for my d desktop.
1 x LENOVO ThinkPad Edge E431 (62775AU) () = $1,132.00
Display 14.0" HD 16:9 "Matte Type" Anti-Glare LED Screen (1366x768)
Dead Pixel Warranty Standard No Dead Pixel Policy
Monitor Calibration NO Professional Monitor Color Calibration
Processor 3rd Generation Intel® Ivy Bridge Core™ i5-3230M (2.6-3.2GHz, 3MB Intel® Smart Cache, 35W Max TDP) (SKU – X2X172)
Thermal Compound Stock OEM Thermal Compound ( IC Diamond Thermal Compound - CPU + GPU Provided FREE with Processor Upgrade!)
Graphics Video Card Intel® HD 4000 Graphics
External Display Video Adapters No Video Adapter
External Mobile Display No External Mobile Display
Ram 8GB DDR3 1866MHz [SKU-424RK] (Kingston HyperX CL11 Dual Channel Memory (2x4GB SODIMMS))
Exterior Finish - Graphic & Textured Wraps Standard Laptop Finish
Exterior Finish - XOTIC PC Laser-Sketch™ No Laptop Laser-Sketch™
Exterior Finish - XOTIC PC Custom Painting (A Panel Only) No Custom Laptop Painting
Exterior Finish - XOTIC PC Custom Painting (Full Chassis) No Custom Laptop Painting
Primary Hard Drive 360GB Corsair Force GS SSD (Read 555MB/s - Write 530MB/s (SATA III)) (SKU - SSD001)
Optical Drive Bay Slim - 8x Super Multi DVDRW/CDRW Combo Drive (Dual Layer w/ Software) (SKU - ODD046)
Optical Drive Bay Hard Drive Caddy No Extra Optical Bay Hard Drive Caddy
External Hard Drive (Back Up) No Back Up Hard Drive
External USB Optical Drive NO External USB Optical Drive
Bluetooth Bluetooth Included *With select wireless cards only* (See “Wireless Network” Section Below)
Wireless Network Built-in Single Band Wireless 802.11B/G/N - Stock Wireless Card + Bluetooth 4.0 (SKU - WIFI15)
Wireless Network Accessories No Network Accessory
Memory Card Reader Internal 4-in-1 Card Reader (SD/MMC/MS/MS PRO)
Camera Integrated Digital Video Camera
TV Tuner No TV Tuner
Sound Card Sound Blaster Compatible 3D Audio - Included
Case No Carrying Case
Battery Smart Li-ion Battery (6-Cell)
Car Adapter No Car Adapter
Port Replicators / Docks / Adapters No Dock/Hub/Adapter
Fingerprint Reader Integrated Fingerprint Reader
Headsets No Headset
Keyboard (External) No External Keyboard
Mouse Accessories No External Mouse
Notebook Cooler No Notebook Cooler
OS Redline Boost No Operating System Redline Boost
Operating System Windows 7 Professional 64-Bit Pre-Installed + Drivers & Utilities Disk
Operating System - Clean Installation Option Clean Windows Installation (Install drivers only - no bloatwares) (For factory installed OS only, not required if OS upgrade is selected) (XPC Service)
ADDITIONAL SOFTWARE None
Antivirus Software No Antivirus Essentials Software Bundle
Back Up Software No Back Up Software
Cloud Backup - Unlimited GB Storage No Unlimited GB Cloud Backup
Microsoft Office Software No Office Software
Software Bundle (Not Installed) No Software Bundle
XOTIC PC Global Anti-Theft Protection No Global Anti-Theft Protection (Options below require an operating system)
Warranty 1 Year LENOVO Parts & Labor Manufacturer Warranty (SKU - WTY023)
The XOTIC PC Difference * 24/7 LIFETIME U.S. based technical support
* Extreme QA testing by dedicated technicians
* 24-72 Hour stress testing and benchmarking to ensure top performance and stability
Build Time Standard Production Time
Outside of U.S. Shipping Coverage No Outside of US Shipping Coverage
White Glove Premium Packaging No thanks, standard double boxed packaging is okay with my order
XOTIC Gear No XOTIC PC Gear

## Post 73 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 12:34:26

Oh yeah with the 11 inch Lenovo I got, I also got t a car travel adaptor too.
again, as with the travel device I'll probably replace the 14 inch ultrabook when windows 7 isn't supported anymore.

## Post 74 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 13:40:12

Yes, turboboost gives extra power when needed. Thinkpads have it, if I remember correctly.
Thanks for explaining the windows-enter and windows-u issue. I have heard that both are ways of starting Narrator and got confused! I will need to connect to the internet before I do anything. I have my own modem up here, but am not sure if I have an ethernet cable. But I could connect wirelessly, which is what I do all the time. How do I get to that option in 8? I hope they've improved it since 7, as I found it very annoying there.
Wow! That much for a Thinkpad Ex131 E? Certainly, Thinkpads usually cost that much or more, since they're business machines. But I've seen them on Ebay for under $250! Maybe, this is the one with the better processor. In any case, that's a very good product line, so I'm sure you're happy with it.
I got a brand new slimb, usb-powered external burner for $26.89. It does everything, except blue ray, and I've never even seen one of those. If anything, I use cd, cdrw, dvd, and dvdrw/dvd+rw. But if I use them twice a year, that's a lot. I just bought this incase I need to rip cds to mp3s or play around with live dvds of Linux.
As I said in that PDA thread, I now have a few desktops in mind, so will need to see what I can find, if it meets my specifications, and if not, if the seller is able to modify it so that it does. I would go for a truly custom-made machine, but those are probably $1,000 or more, especially if I don't want cheaply-made parts in it and am not satisfied with the cookie-cutter approach that many places use.

## Post 75 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 13:48:21

Yes it is expensive, but remember I paid extra for the drive upgrade to solid state storage, and extra for the ram upgradwe to8 gigs. I think the base model is something like $535 or so. had a 500 gig hard drive, and 4 gigs of ram.
T This I3 model that i'm using doesn't have turbo boost as the Core I3's don't have tu turbo boost.
To et onto the wifi under windows 8, it s is siular to 7. Once you are on it though, you can set it to always remember the wifi so it'll just autoconnect.

## Post 76 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 14:20:38

That makes sense. *smile* The original price isn't bad at all!

## Post 77 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 14:22:47

Smile.
and no touch screen!
Though not sure how long they'll make it, as this model came out in July 2012.

## Post 78 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 14:40:49

I personally could not get narrator to run after my update from 8 to 8.1on my laptop.
But I installed 8 over Windows 7, than I updated to 8.1. and didn't worry about it, because when I was updating I have a sited guest visiting.
On my desktop that came with 8 installed, I think I just simply went to the add features to Windows, this guided me to the store, and it just installed.
I think I'd arror on the safe side and just ask for that 5 minutes for them to be available just in case. Smile.
Glad this question was answered. It came up on another board, and although posters were saying the could, they never said how.

## Post 79 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 14:50:41

I have to agree with the others on buying quality machines.
I don't agree that they require so much power, especially for a user that doesn't need it, but as I've posted on other boards of yours, a blind person that doesn't have support should buy a new computer so that they can get technical support when required.
Otherwise, you spend more money.
Like you paid 200 for your latest computer, and another 350, I think you said for the one with Windows 7 you couldn't get to work right.
You had to send that computer to a frined, why I didn't understand, but.
Next, that friend couldn't get Windows 7 working, and again I don't understand why.
That computer has come back with a different OS, that was suppose to "just work" but doesn't.
So, you've spend 550 on machines, plus shipping.
This also was time wasting trying to figure out.
You could have spent like 400 dollars, had a what I call working computer with good power, and tech support to boot.
That machine would have something like an i3 or dual core AMD processor, 4 to 6 GB ram, and Windows 7, if that was what you desired.
Out of the box, it would have just worked, or if not you'd have had tech support to come to your house if need be to find out why not.
I also run powerful machines, but probably mine work harder.
Desktop runs i5 quad processor with boost, and 8GB ram at 1600. However, I have sighted gust that play games. The video card is also a top noch affair.
I paid 550, because I'm a cheap person. So shop.

## Post 80 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 14:59:06

I don't have sited people playing any video games or anything of the like, so I don't need dedicated video like wayne may have.
Tiff, you are right. I am very happy with my X131E. I've never had anything that booted windows so fast. Its really an amazing little device.
Wayne, I am curious. who provides tech support like that? Not that I need it, but i'm wondering.

## Post 81 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 15:00:12

I also agree with Wayne that you way spent a lot of money trying to get old tech to work
I think you woulda been better off taking that money and getting a better system than you got.

## Post 82 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 15:04:10

Dell, Lenovo, HP, some phone companies, like Centry Link are offering it as well.
By an XPS machine, you get on site support.
I've needed it when the mother board died on one computer I had a long time back.
Hard drive died once too. Within 24 hours someone came around and replaced it.
On my new computers I've not had to have any.
In her case when her drivers or Windows 7 wasn't working, someone would have come to her place.

## Post 83 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 15:06:45

She could use something like that.
she doesn't have the sited help. I don't think they honesty wanna help her.

## Post 84 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 15:11:32

It's handy.
I can understand being in that boat, because I once was myself.

## Post 85 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 15:14:00

I know nothing is full proof, but you'd think if you spent more for a better box, then the chances of the hardware going bad are less of a concern.

## Post 86 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 15:57:54

Because things are manufactured, they are prone to messing up.
I once heard it said, that if a computer or electronic device last 3 oto 6 months, it will probably be fine.
Highter priced gear, or quality companies normally offer 1 year anyway. Some with the on site repair built in and others you have to purchase this separate.
I'll bet John on both your systems you could purchased this policy.

## Post 87 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 15:58:23

I don't think that Elitebook was $350, but it may have been. If so, it was certainly no more than that. I'll need to check. Anyway, Lee had an issue with key validation on his Windows 7 Ultimate disk, and neither of us can figure it out. He bought it sealed from Ebay, and it came with all the packaging, the address for Microsoft, and a certificate of Authenticity! So he's going to write to the seller and call Microsoft to see if it's genuine. In any case, if I don't keep this machine, it will be sold for a good price, so I didn't really lose anything, except time. I'll also be selling several other machines, including my Macbook and Android, as well as some other things, so will definitely get back what I spent on shipping and the like.

## Post 88 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 16:02:12

Since the desktop discussion seems to be going on in this thread, I will post my latest findings here.
Ebay has a Dell Optiplex 755, with all the ports, slots, and expansion bays that I want, for $177.99, plus free shipping! It's manufacturer refurbished, with a fresh copy of Windows 7 Home Premium installed, which I'm sure can be upgraded to 8. Here are the general specs.
http://www.dell.com/us/dfb/p/optiplex-755/pd
http://www.pcworld.com/product/30456/dell-optiplex-755.html
The one on Ebay has a core 2 duo processor at 2.83 GHz, 2gb of ram, a 160gb hard drive and a cd/dvd drive. The ram can be upgraded to 8gb, and Lee, who found this machine, said that the process is easy for him to do. The cd/dvd drive can only burn cds, but I can either have it upgraded or just use my external for that. . This machine always comes with what I want, so I can probably find a slightly more expensive one with better ram and maybe a faster processor as well.
Obviously, this is not as good as the nearly $400 Optiplex 7010, with a 3.40ghz processor, 4gb ram, a 500gb hard drive, and Windows 7 installed.
http://www.dell.com/us/dfb/p/optiplex-7010/pd
http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell_OptiPlex_7010_spec_sheet.pdf
The only extra things that I would do with a desktop are printing, translating things into braille and embossing them (for personal use/not professionally), and ocr scanning. The rest of the time, as with a laptop, I would be using Wordpad, surfing the net, listening to music via Youtube or mp3s, making simple audio/video recordings, Skyping, and using Samnet and Klango. The only games I play are ones for the blind. So is it really worth it for me to get the newer machine? Finally, I don't understand all of these processors. If you have a dual core running at 2ghz, does it mean that you basically have a processor running at 4ghz, or does one core serve as an auxiliary when the other is tasked too much? Then, there are core 2 duos, quad cores, and dual cores with other names besides Pentium, like i3, i5, and i7. I have no idea what any of this means or if I even need to worry about it!

## Post 89 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 16:04:40

Ah! Your friend had a problem because.
1. You can't use the same key to validate another system.
2. Your windows key, provided your system came with Windows 7 should have been posted on a sticker on the machine. If not you'd have to purchase Windows 7.
3. So if that were the case, using your key would have solved that problem.
I remember you asking about how, and we posting on your problems with Windows 7 how to do it.
If he's used his key once, that is why he can't use it again unless he removes it from the current machine.
This also should have been written in the directions on his packaging on the key card, the fact Windows is to be used only on one machine at a time.

## Post 90 by LeoGuardian (You mean there is something outside of this room with my computer in it?) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 16:06:04

John said nothing is foolproof.
I agree with this: I've been in the software industry for around 20 years. If there is one thing I know: Anytime you foolproof something, they come out with a better fool.

## Post 91 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 16:09:35

True enough. Smile.

## Post 92 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 16:10:20

I expect a desktop to last a minimum of five years, though more like ten, unless some absolutely major thing happens with the operating system and my computer can no longer run it easily. As far as my parents, we're extremely close, and they'll do anything for me. But Mom barely knows anything about technology, and Joanie just uses it for tasks even more basic than mine! This is the only thing about which they lecture me, because I buy older machines, and I'm really not in the mood for that. Even with this one, I might get "why didn't you buy something that works out of the box", and I would have to explain to them that yes, this is new (a year old at the absolute most), and that there simply is no way for me to upgrade to 8.1 on my own. I also might get "I really don't know anything about Windows 8." Then again, since this is a fairly new machine, I might be worried for nothing and Joanie would just answer the questions and get it done in a matter of minutes. Still, it would be nice to be able to take care of it on my own.

## Post 93 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 16:14:34

He had the problem with that disk even when he opened it for the first time and installed it on his own machine. It said the key was invalid. That said, if my Elitebook has the sticker on it, which it should, can he use his disk to install it and then my sticker for the key? My computer didn't come with any kind of operating system or recovery disks, and the whole reason why we didn't just use the built-in recovery option from HP was that it was corrupt and not working. But I also want to put Windows 7 on my Thinkpad X60. Do we need to buy a new copy, and if so, would it be better to skip 7 and go straight to 8?

## Post 94 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 16:28:38

I can't say anything about your Thinkpad X60, because I have no idea what it's condition is, but I'll tell you this.
When installing one run programs, like operating systems that are licenses for one machine at a time, you need to purchase one for each machine you wish to install it on.
This new computer you just got should be easy to update par instructions JH and Leo have provided here.
However, I still suggest that 5 minutes of sitting next to you from a sighted person in case you run in to difficulties.
Serve your guest a nice cup of coffee, and a sweet treat while they hang out. Smile.

## Post 95 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 18:53:42

I'm known for great coffees. *smile* But I'd probably just bring it downstairs, to the main house, and we could install it there. To those who know, if I use Narrator from the beginning for this, will it stay on, or must I reenable it after the reboot?
As for machines, I have a laptop that I thought could barely run 7. But I heard that 8 can work with low-powered machines. So I decided to read the system requirements, and this is what I found for 8.1.
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/system-requirements
Processor: 1 gigahertz (GHz) or faster with support for PAE, NX, and SSE2 (more info)
•
RAM: 1 gigabyte (GB) (32-bit) or 2 GB (64-bit)
•
Hard disk space: 16 GB (32-bit) or 20 GB (64-bit)
•
Graphics card: Microsoft DirectX 9 graphics device with WDDM driver
These are the relevant specifications for my machine.
http://h20566.www2.hp.com/portal/site/hpsc/template.PAGE/public/kb/docDisplay?javax.portlet.begCacheTok=com.vignette.cachetoken&javax.portlet.endCacheTok=com.vignette.cachetoken&javax.portlet.prp_ba847bafb2a2d782fcbb0710b053ce01=wsrp-navigationalState%3DdocId%253Demr_na-c00248706-1%257CdocLocale%253D%257CcalledBy%253D&javax.portlet.tpst=ba847bafb2a2d782fcbb0710b053ce01&ac.admitted=1401309029288.876444892.199480143
Microprocessor
Intel Pentium4 Processor 2.66GHz
Memory Max
Maximum Memory 1024MB DDR SDRAM (2 x 512MB)
Hard Drive
60GB enhanced-IDE
Video Graphics
ATI MOBILITY RADEON; 4X AGP 3D architecture
Video Memory
64MB DDR SDRAM (shared)
To put this into perspective, I have a Dell laptop that barely meets the requirements for XP. It's a Pentium II, with only 256mb of ram, and a 10gb hard drive. , I did not buy it, nor would I ever have asked to have XP installed on it. I will either be selling it or turning it into a DOS or Linux machine. Since my Pavilion is like that, in that it just manages to meet the requirements for 8.1, will it work like my Dell on XP, or does Windows 8 have better management for such things? If so, then I may have found my desktop solution. The only thing it needs is a new power jack, which Lee has. Of course, all of the actual desktops that I've suggested are much newer and more powerful than this. But it's a shame to let a good laptop go to waste, and it would only be used for emergencies or when I'm using a scanner, embosser, or printer. Maybe, I'll just have XP freshly reinstalled on it.
If not, then can anyone offer me some easy to understand information about processors and whatnot, so that I can decide which of these desktops to buy? Thanks.

## Post 96 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 20:13:23

Most processors are spec.
Your machine with 512 doesn't have enough jump, so it won't work.
Not for Windows 7 nor 8.
Running 7 or 8 on the min requirements works, but not well. It's slow.
So, no, this computer won't due.

## Post 97 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 20:24:53

Actually, it has the full 1gb of ram, not 512mb, if that's what you meant. Still, I'd rather not take a chance and use something that will run so slowly. Thanks for clarifying that. It looks like I'm back to the desktop drawing board.

## Post 98 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 20:39:44

Well, remember, 32 bits runs on one GB or ram.
Next, I'm a user of powerful machines. Even my net book, and I think it is slow, but it works, has 2GB ram. It has the Adam processor and it runs Windows 7 pro just fine, but slowly.
Doing emails, general surfing is okay, but you have to wait.
I traded up and now use a laptop with an I3 processor that runs at 2.3 I think, plus this machine is 64 bit with 6GB ram running hi at 1600.
Better. Lol
I still think with 1GB on that computer, and you posted 512, it doesn't have enough jump.

## Post 99 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 20:58:04

Memory Max
Maximum Memory 1024MB DDR SDRAM (2 x 512MB)
So each slot is 512mb, for a total of 1024mb. Regardless, I don't want to chance it. I'll find something else to do with that machine, because I really don't want to sell it, unless I can find another Pavilion with similar features and better specs to replace it. That really is a full desktop replacement.

## Post 100 by season (the invisible soul) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 21:08:47

John, Graphic card runs much more than just playing video games, or anything to do with Graphic. Graphic card is one of the very important component of a PC. It may not seen that way, and of course, some blind people can argue as much as they like about no needing the graphic and so on, but it is an important over all of the PC...

## Post 101 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 21:18:59

Sure the graphics card is important, but the average card can due for a blind person.

## Post 102 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 21:45:20

I’ll try to break this down.
You asked me privately about processors, and this is how I think of these.
Now, this is just my way to define these, others might add their opinions too.
If you are talking Intel, the i3 5 and 7 are just models.
I think of these like models of computers.
When you add the core part, dual or quad, this means 2 barrels or 4 barrels, or nozzles that are shooting.
If you have 2 nozzles shooting data at once, this is more stuff being delivered. 4 nuzzles is delivering even more data at once.
That translates to demand. If you are using lots of programs or something that has lots of data it has more nozzles to shoot from, so fires without a traffic jam or clog.
Now we get to speed. How fast these nozzles fire. This is the GHZ part. 1.0 1.6 1.9 2.3 3.1 and so on relates to how high the water pressure is turned up.
If you turn a faucet on, but low, you don’t have much water going. Crank the handle and you spray more water. So 1.0 is low flow, even if you do have 2 nozzled for it to flow from, it is a weaker spray than say the 2.3.
AMD has different models, but the idea is the same. Higher end processors have more nozzles, but that you’ll not need anyway.
Intel, in my opinion tend to have better water pressure and run cooler over AMD’s, but AMD’s are cheaper, more bang for your dollars, and do work just fine.
Of course you understand that memory, graphics cards matter in the power equation of a system too, but I have only talked processors.
How did I do pros?
Smile.

## Post 103 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 21:56:05

I understood all of that, especially because Lee works with pumps for fire, water, etc. and we've discussed rate, pressure, sprinkler heads and so on. But what's the difference between a core 2 duo at 2ghz and one of these new dual core processors at 2ghz, or for that matter, a quad core? Using your example, are all shooting water equally, basically giving me a 4ghz or 8ghz speed?

## Post 104 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:04:53

Not exactly. If you have 2 nozzles shooting at 2.0GHZ and 4 at 2.0GHZ your water gets spread faster with 4 Nozzles.
Now remember, if you up the demand, you will get a traffic jam in the 2 nozzles, but have more space so less of a jam with the 4 nozzles.
So, even with 2.0GHZ on a dual the 2.0 GHZ does better on 4 nozzles if demand gets higher.

## Post 105 by season (the invisible soul) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:14:07

Not necesary, I3, I5, and I7 is not just different model. It got different capability as well. Let me try to find something in plain english and i'll post it here

## Post 106 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:19:39

Thanks to both of you. I sincerely appreciate your help. Check post 88 in this thread, to read about my specific situation and questions.

## Post 107 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:29:31

Models in that they have different features sure, but still models.
Tooyota has different models and they have different capabilities.
Go Joanne.
English is hard for me to find on this subject, so lets see what you got. Smile.
This topic might help others as well.

## Post 108 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:34:06

Clock speed isn't as much as an issue as it used to be, but yes it is important.
Joanne, it'd be helpful if you could explain this raphics thing to me.
What benefit would I have gotten from getting an ultrabook with the 4th gen processors? I understand battery life, but battery life isn't a concern at all for me. Ok so the graphics chipset has a higher number, but what does that mean for a blind person if anything?
I never play any games and wont ever play games. so to my way of looking at it, even these 3rd gen processors do totally fine.
I should point out the two models I was looking at ran at the same clock speed, just one was a Core I5 3rd gen and one was a core I5 4th gen.

## Post 109 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:41:39

Here's how i'd explain processors.
Its easier to explain it in what you wil be doing with your computer.
Intel has 3 levels, i3, i5 and i7.
I3 is good for basic tasks and video editing.
I5 is b better, but is what some would call the middle processor, or mainstream processor. good for surfing, basic tasks, more mainstream video editing, and some gaming too.
The Core I7 is for heavy gamers, or for people who need to run intensive tasks. Maybe something like 3D video and audio would require that much power.
Within these models is the clock speed, which is how fast it can do stuff.
the higher the number, the faster it can do things. If you have something with turbo boost, then when the processor needs more power, it can go to this and boost how fast it can do things.
Next you got duel core, qu quad core. having two cores is like taki taking two processors, and shuvving them into one. If t the programs you are using can support it, it it'll take advantage of this extra power. I'm not sure exactly how the cores thing work out in regard to data being done faster.

## Post 110 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:42:55

Considering how I use my computers, I just want to know if I can easily use a core 2 duo at 2.83ghz or if I would need a quad core, or i3/5/7 at 3.2ghz.

## Post 111 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:43:48

see for me, its not easy to understand it the way wayne explained it... because I don't know how water pressure works.
I cant speak for AMD, but know that intel is the standard these days. AMD isn't b bad either, and is a cheaper processor. that doesn't mean every one of AMD's processors are utter shit...

## Post 112 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:45:42

Ok, help me out tif.
I have a core 2 duo, with 4 GB of ram, and Windows 7 32 bit on an 80 gig hard drive.
IT works pretty well for me.
Not nearly as fast as my Thinkpad, but it works well and much b better than XP ever could.
your GHZ speed is fine.
How much ram are we talkin?

## Post 113 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:51:41

Everything is in post 88, including links to specifications for the machines that I'm considering. That said, they can go up to 8gb, and I would probably use 4. I will also copy this from that post.
The only extra things that I would do with a desktop are printing, translating things into braille and embossing them (for personal use/not professionally), and ocr scanning. The rest of the time, as with a laptop, I would be using Wordpad, surfing the net, listening to music via Youtube or mp3s, making simple audio/video recordings, Skyping, and using Samnet and Klango. The only games I play are ones for the blind. Also, I do not edit audio or video.

## Post 114 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:53:56

If you get 4 GB, you'll do fine.
If you get 8 GB, things will just run more smoozly.
Its helpful to have the exact specs of the one you want, so I can tell you.
It s seems a lot of st stuff you post has a range of spec options.

## Post 115 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 22:56:28

There are only two machines in that post, each with two links, since the main links for each didn't explain everything. *smile*

## Post 116 by season (the invisible soul) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:03:35

Great explaination Radio, impressive. Sorry, i'm doing 10 things at ones on my dare i say, Macbookair, haven't have time to put things in plain english.
To quickly answer your question Radio,
Things like Flash, Movies, Youtubes, any site with graphics or videos uses graphic card somehow. It is just the question either you need a super duper graphic card or not, in most basic browsing case, a regular graphic card, or those that come onboard with most *intel* motherboard will do the job just fine/. It is not critical as to which graphic card you choose, but graphic card got it's hidden significant even for us, that does not do gaming much.
I can't answer for Ultrabook, i don't use them, don't tent to use them, and have very little research on them.
As far as battory life is concern, yes, you may not need the battory life at the pressent, or in the near future, but what about in 2 years time, or 4 years time? Again, i'll use my Dell Xps1210M as an example. It is still going fairly well after more than 7 years of service. Untill now, it still outrun my Asus Netbook that i bought in 2011 that supposingly provide me with 7 or 8 hours worth of battory life, but in reality only 4 to 5 hours with very less tasks, and on the lease display setting.
As far as your question about either to go with I3 3rd gen or I3 4th gen, well, it depends on the different in price. They are both in the same catogory, processor, optain a very similar feature. I think, if the different is like $50, i'll personally go for the 4th gen. That is just me, i'll prefer to pay a little bit more for a slidely little bit powerful, and slidely newer tech, rather than spend my $50 in potential downfall. Again, that is just me, i appreciate that perhaps not everyone on this topic share my view, but i honestly don't give a damn care.
If one look up the Del XPS1210M machine, one will more likely find that its a gaming machine. It build for a "serious" gamer. Why i bought this machine, considering i got much more cheaper choice? Easy, i want a machine that will see me through my university years, being one who scann a lot of books and documents, and one who writes a lot, and do all sort of serious academic research on my computer, i need a lite, easy, long battory life, powerful machine that i can use.
And honestly, i think if i went for any less than what i did with it, it won't last me almost 8 years, and still going strong. I can choose to upgrade it to Windows 8 on that machine if i choose to, but at this point of the time, it is unnecesary for me to do so considering the age of the machine.

## Post 117 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:12:40

Your optiplex-7010/pd
would work well provided you got that 4 gigs of ram, the core I3 will do fine and you get windows 7 on it

## Post 118 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:16:52

So the 755 wouldn't be good with 7 or 8?

## Post 119 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:17:00

THanks Joanne. i wasn't sure I'd explain that very well.
Actually it wsa the I5, not I3. the ultrabook desktop replacement will probably never run on battery.
Well seeing as i would get everything custem, it'd cost more anyway. You c can see what i got in the topic earl earlier on this thread.
I have had this current old slow XP desktop for 8 y years now, but some of the hardware is much much older. I'd rather get something new in say 5 years, as I think by that point, there will be a new processors, faster ram, faster SSD's, and who knows what windows wh what. 10 or whatever it called wil hold.
Yeah see for basic tasks, i wasn't think you'd need all that extra graphics power.
If you had Insane fast internet, would pages l load faster though? especially the ones with heavier use of g graphics?

## Post 120 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:18:01

I didn't see a 755 anywhere.
The two links in post 88 had the sm same model number, so i just looked at the first one.

## Post 121 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:19:36

Battery life is important to me, which is why I spent so much time looking for a laptop, before I finally decided on the Asus 1015E.

## Post 122 by season (the invisible soul) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:28:56

oops, sorry, me bad, for some reason i keep thinking about I3 processor hehehe. Been talking about different processors from phone to computer for the last few days lol.
Yes, regardless of what machine it is, custom build machine with customise specs will always cost more than the ready build with regular specs machine. Good on you for choosing the SSD drive though, as someone that already using one, i'm pretty sure you can tell the different from a regular moving harddrive to a SSD. If you don't intent to use the battory much, can i suggest you to remove the battory, but give it a good use ones a week or twice a month, and recharge it again? that will help the battory to stay alife for a longer period of time.
For whoever that post about translating from text to braille, well, sorry to say, it does take up some ram space. In fact, whatever you do takes up ram space somehow. The very example will be using screen reader, doesn't matter which screen reader it use, it takes up ram space, the only different is either the screen reader takes up more ram source or less source.
As far as basic audio recording is concern, again, it does takes up ram space too. Yes, you can perhaps do it with 512mb of ram, or 1gb of ram, but you will pretty much drag it with you. Like for me now, as i insist on using the original Skype, not some other third party software, i can't use my Skype on my Dell Laptop and multi task at the same time. The reason behind it is that the fan is somewhat bugget, it won't takes on the tasks too well, and also, i don't have enough ram to say, Skyping, Recording, Scanning, and writing at the same time. Yes, OCR scanning takes up ram space too. In fact, it takes up quite a lot of ram space...

## Post 123 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:31:28

Like Joanne, the battery life relistc only is 4 to 5 hours. I also have a Dell laptop that promised 7 hours, but I don't get that ever.
You could get away with a core cual 560 intel, but the I3 would be better.
Desktops are going to mainly have the better variety of the I3 installed over laptops, so they will do just fine.
I personally run a hight graphics card for the people that come buy and play games. If you don't have anyone sighted using the computer, the variety that are entergrated work fine these days.
Thanks John for a water thing. I assumed every one understood water pressure, due to feeling this when you take a shower or use water in a sink. You can adjust the pressure. Smile.

## Post 124 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:34:18

Now I'll add there are different models of the models.
If we are talking Intel, the I5 has a cual core and a quad core. The I7 has a variety of models as well, but you'll not be going that high.
I3 has different levels too. All dual core on the I3 however.

## Post 125 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:36:20

At the absolute minimum, the desktop would have 4gb of ram, though I might upgrade it all the way to 8gb, depending on whether 32bit or 64bit Windows is installed. While I occasionally multitask, mostly, it's just opening various browser or Wordpad windows at once, and maybe Skype. But I don't do heavy tasks, like Skype, scanning, and recording, all at once.

## Post 126 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 28-May-2014 23:40:26

The first two links and explanation in post 88 are for the 755, and the next two are for the 710. Here is the 755.
http://www.dell.com/us/dfb/p/optiplex-755/pd
http://www.pcworld.com/product/30456/dell-optiplex-755.html

## Post 127 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 4:08:32

Here is what I used to h help me out when I was st doing some lookin around before my purchase. I didn't buy from this company though.
http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Specs-Explained-CPU-137/

## Post 128 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 4:11:24

Ok I couldn't find the specs for the motherboard and processor.
The only thing I saw when clicking on tech specs is the Ports, Slots & Chassis.

## Post 129 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 13:43:03

This is why I gave two links. At the second, it says this.
Processor
Processor type
Intel Core 2 Duo E4500
Processor speed
2200.0 MHz
The one on Ebay has a core 2 duo processor at 2.83 GHz, 2gb of ram, a 160gb hard drive and a cd/dvd drive. The ram can be upgraded to 8gb, and Lee, who found this machine, said that the process is easy for him to do. The cd/dvd drive can only burn cds, but I can either have it upgraded or just use my external for that.

## Post 130 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 14:09:40

IT'll run ok.
Having more ram will deffinetly help.
you knowe what I mean by ok right? its not gona be blazing fast, but it'll work.

## Post 131 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 14:10:17

To add to that, I wouldn't just do 2 gigs of ram. i'd get at least 4.

## Post 132 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 14:18:47

I entered systeminfo32 on my current desktop, and this is what it says.
System Manufacturer SYX
System Model snc302eeh
System Type X86-based PC
Processor x86 Family 15 Model 2 Stepping 7 GenuineIntel ~2399 Mhz
Total Physical Memory 512.00 MB
Available Physical Memory 30.38 MB
Total Virtual Memory 2.00 GB
Available Virtual Memory 1.95 GB
Page File Space 1.97 GB
I am assuming that this is a single core processor, but it's still fast enough for my needs. The real issue here is ram. If it was 1gb or 2gb, let alone 4gb, it would probably run fine. If all of that is true, the ones I'm considering are dual core and have more memory, so will probably run even faster. But I need to take into account the differences between XP, 7, and 8, and which of the latter two I'll be using.

## Post 133 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 14:20:03

Since this is a desktop, I naturally want it to be more powerful than my laptop. So I definitely want at least 4gb of ram. *smile*

## Post 134 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 14:22:23

That' using 7 right? I like how bel belarc puts things better. I found your info a lil confusing to read. e the part about the processor e especially
what your gonna run into with anything less than 4 GB is slow s programs, or prograsm have to right to the hard drive cause ther there isn't enough memory to do the task, etc.

## Post 135 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 14:24:00

tiff eleni, you want at least 4 GB ram on anything that runs a modern operating system such as windows 7 or 8. I don't care if its a laptop or desktop. smile.
Keep in mind that a lot of pc's today are shipping with 4 GB of ram as the minimum. that should tell you something too... smile

## Post 136 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 14:32:56

The Asus 1015E came out last year, with Windows 8 on it, and the maximum memory it can take is 2gb. Yet the reviews that I've read on it all praised it as being a fast machine for daily tasks and such. It's not a gaming machine or one for serious editing of photos and audio, but I don't do any of that.

## Post 137 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 14:39:48

Have you forgotten that your screen reader uses up a good chunk of ram?
maybe the reviews said how fast it was, but were they tryin to run a screene reader too?
and fast is a relative termb.... smiles.
I wouldn't have baught that asus.

## Post 138 by forereel (Just posting.) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 15:02:13

Actually, many lower level business machines ship with 2GB ram. These are 64 bit machines, however, so can be upgraded.
2GB and Windows 7 or 8 even running a screen reader work when the processor is a dual core of some kind and at 1.8at least.
Ram is easy to install.
That last computer won't run 7 or 8 at all, sorry.
I speak of the one with the 512 physical memory.
I agree with John, I'd want 4GB, and 4GB is easy to get, even on lower priced computers.
Seems you are set on used again, so I'd like to know how your Asus is working?
Because that computer has 2GB ram, howbeit, a slower processor, it will be a great bech mark of what you can expect from a desktop with 2GB as well.
It will run a bit faster, but not by much.
So, say, how does the Asus work.
Does it meet your basic needs easy?
Don't forget, that some sights like YouTube suggest you have a processor that runs at 2.2GHZ to get the best from the site.
I can't remember where I read this, but I suspect it is due to some folks being able to shoot and upload some pretty heavy video content.

## Post 139 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 19:18:16

Wayne is correct. there's no way in hell a computer with 512 MB of ram will run vista, much less 7 or 8.exe.

## Post 140 by season (the invisible soul) on Thursday, 29-May-2014 19:40:36

In the case of Asus, the ram stop at 2gb. it will more likely to be a 2 slots of 1gb ram. So, no, the machine will more likely to be shift with 1gb of ram, or upgradable to 2gb of ram, and thats it. Of course, one can argue that it can run all right, but running a screen reader on a 2gb ram space with anything less than a I3 processor is almost like pulling a car with a motorbike. And, i said this from experience dealing with Window 7 home basic, the most basic OS for wind 7 you could get.

## Post 141 by blbobby (Ooo you're gona like this!) on Friday, 30-May-2014 7:09:55

I just want to jump in here and say that I've been lerking on this topic for a long time, and learning a bunch.
I well understand Tiffinitsa's need to get the best that a little money can buy, and (perhaps, her love for the untraveled road?).
However, having just made the jump from an old tired xp machine to a reasonably powered win7 machine, I have noticed some benefits that the additional power can provide.
Firstly, I can go to sites that I had just assumed were too graphically based. One example is the huffington post (sorry I don't remember the url). On my xp machine, the browser would just hang. Now this site launches with no problem.
Secondly, I love the new search box. No need to learn the physical location of files, jus type their name in, and voila! there it is.
Finally, all those fears I had about a big learning curve have not come true. Sure it's different, but it's certainly doable, and, frankly, a lot of fun doing it.
So, keep up the discussion of various trade offs etc. just be aware there are a few of us lerkers out here taking notes.
Thanks.
Bob

## Post 142 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Friday, 30-May-2014 7:36:52

The search feature you describe in 7 works under 8.exe as well, bob.
The nice addition of 8.exe is that it'll put results from the web at the bottem of your search results from your pc and local files.

## Post 143 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Friday, 30-May-2014 13:27:14

*smile* I had no intention of using this one for 7 or 8. This is actually the desktop that's being replaced. But I want the new one to have similar built-in options for ports, slots, drives, modem, etc. Regardless, it and the Dell naturally work very slowly with XP, and I wanted to know if I should expect the same type of speed with my new Asus, or even one of the desktops that I'm considering. I hope not. There is a difference between not as fast as the rest and making a 486 look speedy! haha To be fair, those are, when they're running DOS. They boot up in a few seconds, and so does my Itronix, which is a Pentium.
I'm still waiting for the Asus, and praying that it comes soon. There was no way to change the shipping option. But several reviewers said it worked well with Youtube, even the hd videos, and those at higher resolutions. Apparently, there's a way to change the quality of what you're watching, but of course, that's not accessible. At any rate, I definitely want at least 4gb on my desktop.
As for search, I have used it in 7, and prefer the XP approach, where I can set criteria for exactly what I want to find and where I want to find it.

## Post 144 by forereel (Just posting.) on Friday, 30-May-2014 15:24:33

Ah, for some reason I thought you'd already received the Asus? Thought I'd read that on one of these boards.
That lady must have put it on a mule train. Smile.

## Post 145 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Friday, 30-May-2014 15:31:07

I know, right? I like old things, but the Pony Express really is a bit much!

## Post 146 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Friday, 30-May-2014 23:38:39

Why not get a Cybertron PC? You get free tech support on the phone and can buy an on-sight repair policy. There is a model for $569.00 that would last you along time.
It has the following components:
Processor: AMD QuadCore at 3.8 GHZ; 1 TB HD; 8 GB of installed ram; 1 GB dedicated graphics card; you have to buy a wireless adapter; Bluetooth. Great machine. Can give you a link if interested.

## Post 147 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 0:25:45

I don't use blue tooth, but I do use wireless. If this machine comes with everything that I want, either built-in or easily added on (very cheaply), I might consider it.

## Post 148 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 2:12:06

Nathon likes to suggest things that are overkill.
although I wil take a look at the company because i'm curious. lol
Personally, I think your asus will either be slow, or the hardware will crap out within say two years.

## Post 149 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 2:13:31

what are the specs on that device? tell me what they are and i'll tell you if it will run like shit.
i'll need your exact config to tell you that though.
wasn't it a Pentium processor with something like 2 gigs of ram? that'll run horrible.

## Post 150 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 14:01:25

These are the relevant specifications. The full list can be found here.
http://www.asus.com/Notebooks_Ultrabooks/1015E/specifications/
Processor
Intel® Celeron® Dual-Core 847 GHz Processor
Chipset
Intel® Chief River Chipset HM70
Memory
DDR3 1600(O.C.) MHz SDRAM, OnBoard Memory 2 GB / 4 GB
Graphic
Integrated Intel® HD Graphics
I didn't realise that this could take 4gb. Interesting! I wonder if it can be upgraded?

## Post 151 by forereel (Just posting.) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 14:59:34

You just buy another 2GB stick at the same 1600 or specs. Easy to install.
I don't know how mechanical you are, but most times you remove the keyboard. Remove the screw over the memory bay, I'll call it.
You feel the existing card to see what direction your new one should go, and put it in.
Close everything up.
Start the computer, wait for a bit or until you are sure it fully booted.
Restart, and you are set.
Why does a computer that cost 500 bucks need a wireless adapter?
Also Nathan, did you get Windows activated?

## Post 152 by forereel (Just posting.) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 15:03:49

I forgot to add.
For ease of setup. Buy the memory directly from Asus. This insures you have the exact type and kind you require, if you decide to update.
With it's current specs as I've said before, it will be generally okay for general things, but not fast.
Better then a netbook, and I believe that was your wish.

## Post 153 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 15:27:48

I'm not sure how this one is configured. Sometimes, Asus will sodder the memory onto the motherboard. At other times, you can upgrade it, but it's a bit difficult. I have never done anything like this, and considering how long it's taking to get here, I really don't want to play with it without any sighted assistance.
Yes, that was my wish. *smile* I have used netbooks without any problems, so if this performs better than one, it should be able to meet my needs. I'm certainly not expecting it to be as fast or as powerful as my Elitebook, or even my Thinkpad, especially at $206. Both of the other machines are designed for business, so were far more expensive when they first came out.

## Post 154 by forereel (Just posting.) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 16:06:25

If it says it is upgradable, the memory will be cards. If not, it won't be.

## Post 155 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 18:19:13

Here is what you need to know.
your processor is slow..
Memory
DDR3 1600(O.C.) MHz SDRAM, OnBoard Memory 2 GB / 4 GB
your memory is slow memory. it is also built onto the board. when you ordered the puter, they should give you a choice. if you pick the one with 2 GB, they'll put that on it. if you ask for 4 gB they'll do that instead.
because its built onto the board (as I would expect it to be at this price point...), you wont be able to upgrade it.
keep in mind, if your memory fails, you are totally screwed.

## Post 156 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 18:21:44

Havin a duel core wil help though.

## Post 157 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 18:29:42

I took a look at your processor.
ark.intel.com/products/67419/Intel-BD82HM70-PCH
couldn't find anything about the graphics.
not sure how anything will rendor on that.
I guess when you get it you'll find out how wel it works.

## Post 158 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 18:34:52

http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/chipsets/value-chipsets/mobile-chipset-hm70.html

## Post 159 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 19:59:32

These are the specifications that I'm seeking in a desktop. I left out things like motherboard, hard drive type, processor type, graphics, and screen resolution, because I really don't know about them. While I don't mind a hard drive with more than 160gb, I really don't need it. Likewise, I don't need more than 8gb of ram, and probably don't need a processor faster than 3ghz. I also don't require the 5.25 floppy drive, but some computers do offer the bay for it. If I strictly use Windows, I also don't need the 3.5 drive, nor the serial port. But since this is a desktop, I'm including everything.
Desktop Specifications
Form Factor
small form factor, ultra-small form factor, or desktop (flat)
hard drive
traditional (not ssd)
hard drive capacity
80gb-160gb
Ram
4-8gb
processor
dual core (min)
processor speed
2-ghz (min)
keyboard
Model M keyboard (already owned)
Media
1 3.5 in. (1.44mb or 1 LS240) floppy
1 5.25 in. high dencity floppy
1 dvd+rw
Connectivity
1 RS-232 9-pin male serial port
1 bidirectional female parallel port (2 if possible)
1 ps/2 port (for keyboard)
1 modem jack with internal 56k modem
1 ethernet jack
wireless
1 line-in jack or microphone jack
1 headphone/speaker jack
2 usb 2.0 ports (preferably 4)
OS
Windows 8.1, Linux, DOS (Windows necessary)

## Post 160 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 20:16:03

it sounds like your tryin to mix the old with the new.
any windows 8 box you'll get will have dual core.
most will have at least 4 GB of ram. most wil have at least 300 GB if not 500 GB hard drive capasity.
and just how much do you wanna spend ?

## Post 161 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 21:32:30

For a desktop, I would say $500 or less. This will be a longterm investment, so it's worth the extra money.

## Post 162 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 21:39:49

is there any brand or shop you don't want me to look at?
Do you want windows 8 windows 8.1 or windows 8.1 update?
with windows 8 you know you'll have to do the updates.
and i'll look tomorrow to see what I can find.
you are also wishing to stick to a preconfigured PC, without custem ?

## Post 163 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Saturday, 31-May-2014 21:58:31

I don't mind custom, but if I go that route, then I really do want everything built-in. As for operating system, it can always be upgraded. I don't want to miss out on a good machine, just because it has 8, or even 7, and not 8.1 updated.

## Post 164 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 11:05:48

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/dell-inspiron-3000-series-desktop-intel-core-i3-8gb-memory-1tb-hard-drive/2988051.p?id=1219085424399&skuId=2988051&st=categoryid$pcmcat212600050008&cp=1&lp=1
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/lenovo-desktop-intel-core-i3-6gb-memory-1tb-hard-drive/3269007.p?id=1219091217648&skuId=3269007&st=categoryid$pcmcat212600050008&cp=1&lp=3
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/acer-aspire-tc-series-desktop-intel-core-i3-6gb-memory-1tb-hard-drive/3288113.p?id=1219090032186&skuId=3288113&st=categoryid$pcmcat212600050008&cp=1&lp=4

## Post 165 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 11:16:00

I think you should shoot for the upper end of that price point.
let me know what you think of those and if you don't like them, let me know what you want changed.

## Post 166 by forereel (Just posting.) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 12:41:30

On the Asus John. Remember she didn't order it, she got it used, so is stuck with whatever it is.
It will run better then a netbook, so hopefully she'll like it, if not it will be a waste of money.
Ordering new would have been better due to return policy and ability to construct or buy one with changes. That also would have cost about 50 dollars more with a garentee as I posted earlier.

## Post 167 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 12:42:55

oh I had no idea it was used.
she probably coulda gotten better new.
and hey its new.
so probably get a year warintee

## Post 168 by forereel (Just posting.) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 12:47:47

Good pricing on the Best Buy selections.
I think these are way more powerful then she requires, but you can't say they are expensive.
I'd go for the Dell as well.

## Post 169 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 12:49:15

I'd go for the dell too
that 8 gigs of ram is nice.

## Post 170 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 12:50:05

Wel I think the I3's are minimum/.
she'll shoot me when she sees 1 TB in every one. lol
but that is becoming more and mor the standard.

## Post 171 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 13:34:33

It was literally used one day and then boxed. I tried several stores to get it new, and none of them were selling it. Amazon had a few options, but if I remember correctly, all were from sellers. When I saw the price, and that it was barely used, I decided to go with this one. For the record, whenever I did find it, it always had 2gb.
Anyway, thanks for the computer suggestions. I'll read them now. Yes, an 1tb drive is absolutely ridiculous for my needs. Why a home user would need that much space is totally beyond me.

## Post 172 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 13:36:38

yeah I know it is a lot for you but its cause a lot of people store a lot of shit.....
and hey it comes with the package.

## Post 173 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 13:53:04

To be honest, these all pretty much sound the same, except that the latter two have some expansion options. But no bays, modem, or ports built-in, other than usb. If I can have them add things, that would be fine. But if not, and if I have to connect everything with usb, I might as well just get a powerful laptop. This will stay on my desk, which I want as clutter-free as possible, and should come with a good amount of options, which I'm not really seeing here. Granted, the prices are great, and these are powerful machines. If I can't find anything else, I may very well go with one of these. But this is why I usually get business machines from a few years ago. Since they're slightly older, the prices are good, and they usually either contain the options that I want or a way to have them installed. Some of the modern machines do as well, but being that they're business class, they can get quite expensive.

## Post 174 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 14:18:31

I bet these people could make me a computer. They make legacy systems. So why not a modern one with legacy support?
http://www.nixsys.com/

## Post 175 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 19:23:16

I just looked at PCI computers. the base price is over what your willing to spend.
Legacy OS has very old hardware, and you could probably get cheaper on ebay.
You might try Ava direct.
Its a company i'd consider buying from if my la laptop goes in Florida.
But they wont a have w what you w w want on their site. You'll have to call them and talk to them.
I'll v continue to look.

## Post 176 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 19:41:32

http://shopping.hp.com/en_US/home-office/-/products/Desktops/HP-110/E6S57AV?HP-110-210xt-Desktop-PC
http://shopping.hp.com/en_US/home-office/-/products/Desktops/HP-Pavilion/F3E14AA?HP-Pavilion-500-281-Desktop-PC-with-Windows-7
http://shopping.hp.com/en_US/home-office/-/products/Desktops/HP-Pavilion/E6S58AV?HP-Pavilion-500-200t-Desktop-PC
http://shopping.hp.com/en_US/home-office/-/products/Desktops/Desktops;pgid=e5tgUzff7ShSRpHBSkdvbeZ000007V03EymA;sid=54x8zDQHaN57zGeMUdZnQewI1yNAWASo2xgttGlTYAA2DVSXoEUWmXrX?SearchParameter=%26%40QueryTerm%3D*%26ContextCategoryUUID%3DOp0QxXjbaUcAAAE0eehcZzOt%26Processor_facet_DTE2_desktops_dte2%3DIntel%26%40Sort.TieredPricing%3D0&PageSize=15&SortingAttribute=TieredPricing-asc
That one above seems to have the most USB ports
However I still think you get more from your buck at best buy.

## Post 177 by b3n (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 20:07:25

On the off chance that you would be willing to pay what will be a very high shipping charge (UK to USA) I could build a desktop as per your above specs. Probably better to ask someone in America though.

## Post 178 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 20:10:30

yeah it sure is better to ask somebody in America.
such as Ava Direct.
You could call Xotic PC. they'll talk to you e even if you don't buy a system from them. I know they do mostly gaming PC's, but they might be able to suggest something.

## Post 179 by season (the invisible soul) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 20:34:33

Back to basic Tif, and be practicle. What do you need your desktop and laptop for? What you want to get out of it. How you determine to use your desktop/laptop will determine what system you need, from what hardware you have to what OS you run. Answers like having my laptop working on my lap when i'm out at the sundeck and having desktop on my desk is not the answer. You can pretty much do "basic audio video recording, ocr scanning, basic writing, and a bit of braille translation" in almost all system that available on the market at the moment. The question is how much you want to spend time on scanning a page, on converting your recording, on saving a file compare to other people. Jumping all over the place by wanting to have this and that and everything else, and changing your mind every few days or a week does not help to solve the problem, only create more problems for yourself and for others that trying to help you.
And, for a change, can i suggest you buy from a online computer store, instead of going on EBay and similar website?

## Post 180 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 22:31:25

Hi,
Sure did get Windows activated. Works fine.
Dell computers are a piece of crap, unless you spend a lot of money on a computer such as an Alienware. There made cheaply and constructed poorly, too.
The computer company I suggested, Cybertron PC, will custom-build you computers. However, the system I told you about is a pre-configured one. I think there specialty is gaming, as my machine is built for this, but they also can build home PCS, too. They have great customer and tech support services, most can be configured with 8 GB of ram, and many have AMD processors, which will save you some money because they are cheaper than Intel, but they work just as well in my opinion. They run a little hotter though, but they can add plenty of cooling possibilities; my pre-configured system has a total of 6 fans to keep everything cool, and each can be adjusted (that is, the speed independently.)
Your probably not going to find a modem jack or the other ports you suggested unless you get something custom-built, but, as I said, this is why you can go custom. If you can, USB 3.0 ports are much faster than 2.0, but if you don't have any compatible USB 3.0 devices, it won't matter to you anyway.
I thought you had a friend named Lee, who works on computers? What you could do is go to a site such as www.tigerdirect.com or www.newegg.com, purchase all the parts (of course, these would be all separate, and get Lee to put it together for you. Since he's a friend, maybe he wouldn't charge that much labor? Just an idea. I wouldn't recommend Dell though. I could recommend them in 2001, but not now.
Nathan.

## Post 181 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 22:36:10

I just figured i'd try to find stuff that was within her price point that is easy. you buy it and it co comes ready to use.
i'm not sure she wants to get into all the nuts and bolts of custem built jobs.

## Post 182 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 23:13:51

Lee can do small repairs and upgrades, but I doubt he could build a computer. But knowing him, he would probably want to try, and he works with fire, water, oil, etc. pumps all the time, so he knows about electricity and safety standards. Still, I would rather have a company build one if I decide on a custom machine. Most places I've seen offer a page for configuration, but they're either not fully accessible, or they don't offer all the options that I want. Still, they may be able to do it if I write to them.
If I buy one of these premades, maybe, I can have things added to it, which is just as good. I guess it depends on price and what's easier.

## Post 183 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 23:17:41

well. yeah you'll have to write them to get what you want.
the stuff I gave you is just what's available that I think would be ones to consider for you.

## Post 184 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 23:33:25

Yes, call the computer company that your interested in. You'll get a quicker response doing it this way then writing an email. Also, I know you don't want a barebones system, but Zotac is a good uSFF to consider.
Nathan.

## Post 185 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 01-Jun-2014 23:34:39

xotic pc nathon? is that who you mean ?
I just baught from them.

## Post 186 by blbobby (Ooo you're gona like this!) on Monday, 02-Jun-2014 11:23:14

Tiffanitsa said:
"Yes, an 1tb drive is absolutely ridiculous for my needs. Why a home user would need that much space is totally beyond me."
I remember I said the same thing about a windows 98 machine that had 12 gb of disk space.
Can't have to much hard drive.
Bob

## Post 187 by forereel (Just posting.) on Monday, 02-Jun-2014 18:57:40

I don't know Nathan about Dell's being pieces of crap.
My Windows on all mine was activated.
Instead of the life time support, I get an actual tech, provided I have a problem, that comes to my door, not over the phone, to repair my systems.
There are companies here that will build custom systems for 500 dollars. I could post some.
We've been talking about your serial and other type ports you want, and that is the only thing you've not found on the systems given you.
I explained why these ports are not available, due to them not being useful.
Even is you have things that can connect to them, chances are, you'll not find updated software or drivers.
You can't even mosttimes get printer ink for older printers anymore, so they will simply sit on your desk unable to print.
I don't think you need all the power presented, and have sent you several systems.
Next, you said you couldn't find that Asus new? I posted it exactly new, you just said the battery wasn't going to be good enough.
I suspect that one you'll finally receive battery won't last long either.

## Post 188 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Monday, 02-Jun-2014 19:18:11

wel the Hp's I posted had less stuff in them, but still would do you nicely.

## Post 189 by forereel (Just posting.) on Monday, 02-Jun-2014 19:44:44

Yes, they'd do nicely. HP even offers in home support if you wish to add it.

## Post 190 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Monday, 02-Jun-2014 23:41:42

I bet you had to pay extra for an actual tech to come to your house. Yes, Zotac PC. Even though Windows wasn't activated, it wasn't like it was a big deal to do so.
Nathan.

## Post 191 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Monday, 02-Jun-2014 23:44:00

aah i'm gonna take a look to see what they have now.

## Post 192 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Tuesday, 03-Jun-2014 0:56:30

The USFF I was talking about is the Zotac Mini PC found on Amazon.

## Post 193 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Tuesday, 03-Jun-2014 16:38:10

Couldn't see myself owning one of those, personally.

## Post 194 by chelslicious (like it or not, I'm gonna say what I mean. all the time.) on Tuesday, 03-Jun-2014 18:13:30

Nathan, I disagree with you about Dells being total crap. I've owned one for over a year, now, and haven't had any problems with it, so far.

## Post 195 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Tuesday, 03-Jun-2014 23:21:03

Okay, everyone is entitled to his or her own opinion.

## Post 196 by chelslicious (like it or not, I'm gonna say what I mean. all the time.) on Wednesday, 04-Jun-2014 11:37:19

why do you say that, though? what evidence do you have to support that claim?

## Post 197 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Wednesday, 04-Jun-2014 12:15:34

I used to have a Dell Inspiron 1525 laptop; it was at least almost $500.00. With in a year, the screen started to fall apart; the computer wouldn't even boot straight into Windows. It was a crappy system.

## Post 198 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 04-Jun-2014 13:39:06

I admit everyone has there opinions but they have to be based on more then one computer.
All manufactors will have a bad machine sometimes.
I didn't pay extra for the in home support, due to purchasing an XPS model.
So based on the machines you and I purchased, looking for top products, the support was rolled in to the price of my systems. Notice I said systems, not one?
I had a "Friday Monday" system, but Dell hung with it for 4 years, and it gave me great service, because when it did break, I couldn't complain much, due to them coming around and replacing whatever they had to.
They came out 3 times, but I kept it over 6 years.
Becausae I purchase systems for others from time to time or advise on them, several have Dell, HP, and over all no one has had to have the tech visit at all.
Sure, after a few years or due to human using things, some have had to have software fixes, but no hard wear.
I currently own 3 running Dells, and one is a cheap netbook I've have almost 4 years, and it has never had a problem at all.

## Post 199 by chelslicious (like it or not, I'm gonna say what I mean. all the time.) on Wednesday, 04-Jun-2014 18:06:28

I'm sorry, Nathan, but Wayne is right. you can't base saying a whole brand of computers is piss poor, just cause you had one in the bunch that didn't last as it should've.
several years ago, I bought an iPod from Apple, and guess what? that baby was defective.
did I therefore ditch all Apple products, or Apple iPods? no, not at all; I just got a new one, like anyone else would do.

## Post 200 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Wednesday, 04-Jun-2014 18:46:34

Dell XPS models are very, very expensive; how much did you pay? At least $1,000? That's too much in my opinion for a computer.
Nathan.
What are the specs? Just curious.

## Post 201 by season (the invisible soul) on Wednesday, 04-Jun-2014 20:38:45

indeed, everyone have the rights to his or her own opinion. However, I have quite a few friends that have had, or still using Dell Inspiron systems. Nothing wrong with their computers, nothing wrong with their system. Some of them already use it for at least 5 years, and some for only 2 years, deal to mutural upgrade and such. Anyone that half care about my system wwould know that i take pride on my Dell Xps computer that i already have for more than 7 years. I'm not saying that Dell is a 100% perfect company, but sometime, i do wonder, is that the problem with the user more so than the problem with the computer itself?

## Post 202 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Wednesday, 04-Jun-2014 21:26:17

I've had my same del laptop since nov 2006. it so works perfect.
I had to replace the keyboard but that was my fault for popping off the h key, and the CMOS battery simply cause the battery got old and r wore out.
Other than that, it has no problems.

## Post 203 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 14:35:51

I received my Asus on Tuesday, but have been sick and in bed since then. Thankfully, I'm getting better. At any rate, I turned it on and pressed Windows enter and Narrator didn't start. I'm guessing that the previous owner set it back to factory default, and that some kind of setup is on the screen, or they're asking about installing some software. I had that happen once with my Asus. So I'm going to ask Joanie to set up the wireless and do the updates, since I have to give her the machine anyway. Hopefully, we can do this today, though I'll probably start using it tomorrow. I'm sure she has never used Windows 8, so will find the information on how to set up the internet for her. I'll also e-mail her the steps in this thread for updating, so that she can have them in front of her.
As for the desktop, I will probably use various operating systems on it, so it's good to have all the ports. It's not that difficult to find ink ribbons for printers. You just have to know where to look. I even found one for my typewriter, from 1908, a few years ago. What's really annoying me is the lack of a ps/2 port. I didn't even think I needed to specify that on a desktop!
I was confused about the battery for the Asus. The extended one lasts for ten hours. So if that's not the one included here, I can get it. I thought that only the lower capacity battery was available for it. What is a "Friday Monday" system?

## Post 204 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 14:42:51

Well if you need help or get stuck with her, you know how to reach me. I hope it goes well for you!

## Post 205 by forereel (Just posting.) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 19:33:28

Dell XPS specs.
Intel i5 3350P quad core processor at 3.1GHZ with turbo boost.
Install memory 8GB running at 1600MHZ
4 3.0 USB 6 2.0 USB ports.
HDMI port.
NVIDIA GeForce GT 620
13 in 1 Media card reader.
Windows 8, now runs 8.1.1 pro with media center patch.
1TB hard drive running at 7200RPM.
Has Bluetooth 4.0, wirelss, I think it is an intel card. Doesn't require a cable, so connects to my router like a laptop does.
Has extra PCI slots, and upgraded audio so can dish out 7.1 surround sound.
I paid $550 with all my discounts and coupons.

## Post 206 by season (the invisible soul) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 20:26:09

Oh Wayne, from the basic specs, not a bad price for the machine, considering you are buying Dell. My next PC desktop (if i going to get any) will be at least 16gb to 32gb ram, i5 4th gen quat core or I7 3rd gen quat core, with 1tb of diskspace although, in reality i only need like 300+GB but hell to that. lol

## Post 207 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 21:06:04

wow. quad core. ok I gotta ask. do you notice anything difference between a dual core orquad core?
like ok, take jaws or browsing. those programs aren't gonna notice nore use all those cores, are they?

## Post 208 by forereel (Just posting.) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 23:06:53

When it is being pushed it matters. General use no.
I have a laptop with an I3 dual core 6GB, so that is some comparing, but the i5 is faster by lots.
I understand the gaming is better.

## Post 209 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 23:09:08

so i'm gonna way like my I5. smile

## Post 210 by season (the invisible soul) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 23:21:05

Well, depends on how technical you want to get. It is not the matter of what you are doing, is how many things you want to do at the time. and how much you want to multitasking. If you are running jaws, watching a movie, on Skype and recording your Skype convo, downloading a file or two, uploading an attachment on your email, and browsing at the same time, then it will matter either you run a dual core, quat core, 4gb, 8gb, 16gb of ram. Some can also argue that a I3 4th gen quat core will be faster and cheaper than a i5 3rd gen dual core.
At the end of the day, it comes down to what you want to do, need to do, and how long you want your machine to be useful. No point on buying/building a machine that will be useful for you in the next 6/12months, then you realize that its no longer as useful as you thought it will be. Yes, one can argue that windows 8 might able to run on 4gb of ram, what about windows 9, 10, and who knows what to come? OS will only getting bigger with all the stuff that comes with it. It won't get smaller for sure. Hens, why i said if i'm building a computer, i am pretty much build for the future, not for the pass, or for the present. No point for me to get a computer with 4gb of ram, or using i3 processor. I might able to get around it quite comfortably for the next while, but i'm not going to spend another $$$ in next then say, 18 months time and get myself another computer for that present of time.
Anyway, i do think John Radio, your i5 will serve you very well for your next few years.

## Post 211 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 23:25:00

Pretty nice:
Specs for mine:
Cybertron Hellion GM1213 Desktop:
Processor: AMD FX series 6300, hexacore configuration, meaning six cores, 3.5 GHZ, unlocked and ready for overclocking; 16 GB of installed ram; 1 TB 7200 RPM hard drive; NVIDIA GT640 graphics card; 2 GB of dedicated video memory; blue and red lights; six fans throughout case to keep everything cool; built-in wireless; 3.0 and 2.0 ports; one DVI port; one HDMI port; supports dual monitor configuration. Windows 8.1 installed. $770.00; made for gaming I guess; people told me that thes specs aren't that good, so I don't know. Max memory supported equals 32 gb.
Nathan.

## Post 212 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 23:29:50

oh joanne, by the time I get new putres, it'll be 2019, so broadwell may be out of date by then and DDr4 might be DDR5?
yeah I know it'll serve me well for a while yet.

## Post 213 by forereel (Just posting.) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 23:35:09

It is the OS that allows for the dual monitor support. I can do this with my laptop even.
On John's system the i5 will be dual core.
Joanne explains it good. When pushed my laptop doesn't keep as smoothly. I've not been able to push my desktop much.
I normally have Jaws, email, Skype, some pages open, and many times music going at once, and it doesn't much care.
I do wonder if OS will require more power in the future. Soon our computers will take on the home automation task as well.
They can now, but it is going to be more mainstream, so you are probably correct Joanne.
For me however, all that power just never gets used until someone come around and plays games, while Facebooking and such.
My daughter does lots, but she never pushed it either.

## Post 214 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Thursday, 05-Jun-2014 23:37:35

plenty good enough for what i'm doing.
I think the I3 flies as it is so the I5 can only be better.

## Post 215 by season (the invisible soul) on Friday, 06-Jun-2014 2:59:00

John, are you having i3 on your laputter and i5 on your deskputter?
Yes Wane, i think regardless though, you will always have the problem with laptop vs laptop. even if they might both having the same exact spec, you will more than likely find that your lapputter will be slidely slower than your deskputter. After all, lapputter is really, meant for mobile computing, and you do pay for that advanture.
I think, with new os it will get more powerful therefore requires more power and ram and everything else to run. Just look at the size of Windows XP and the size of Windows 8 for example. one can quite comfortably run with 512mb of ram, but with windows 8, it needs at least 4gb of ram or above. Of course, one can argue that you can install it on a 1gb or 2gb machine, but the question is that, do you really want to do that with such a heavy load? Which means, you can only imagine what will be the future OS power be. If we are talking about 16/32gb of ram on a desktop is normal, maybe, by 2019/2020 when John ready to renew your puter will be like 128gb of ram or something lol.
HBoy, with your system, i think the most for me will pay around $500 on it. ADM processor should not cost that much, compare to Intel processor. It is impressive with 16gb of ram, but the impressiveness stop there i think. It is very common to have USB3 nowadays, and it doesn't come with a lot of extras for $770 compare to $550 that what John pay, granted, twice the memory, but hey, memories these days are fairly cheap. If for me to choose between HBoy's and John's boy puter, i'll have John's puter lol.

## Post 216 by forereel (Just posting.) on Friday, 06-Jun-2014 16:35:14

I'd agree. That memory is cheap. All I require is another 8 tray, and bam!
I believe this box can hold up to 24 ponies, but with the processor I have, it doesn't make sense to go that high.

## Post 217 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Friday, 06-Jun-2014 17:33:02

i3 on the laptop, and i5 on the desktop replacement yes.
buttery, the new broadwell chips and DDR4 are coming and that will probably change everything again. lol

## Post 218 by season (the invisible soul) on Friday, 06-Jun-2014 21:57:14

hahaha never mind about the DDR4 Radio, when you change your puter next, we gonna
put DDR5 on it (provided thats what they gonna call it).

## Post 219 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Friday, 06-Jun-2014 22:10:34

lol your probably right. you might know this buttery... but how often do they refresh the ram and processors?
every what. 3? 5 years or so ?

## Post 220 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Saturday, 07-Jun-2014 0:08:17

If you get 16 GB of ram, it's not that cheap.

## Post 221 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Saturday, 07-Jun-2014 7:32:35

Nathon is right on that. 16 GB of ram can be pretty expensive. however, considering how much ram used to cost, the cost of ram has gone down.

## Post 222 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Saturday, 07-Jun-2014 9:18:18

A little, I guess. It is definitely probably 100 dollars or more.

## Post 223 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Saturday, 07-Jun-2014 9:20:19

most don't need to spend that much on ram though. at least, not yet. lol

## Post 224 by forereel (Just posting.) on Saturday, 07-Jun-2014 18:33:17

Processors seems to get updated yearly John.
Ram goes up and down in price depending. If you've already got 8GB upgrading to 16 won't be that bad.
But again, if your processor want work it, nor do you use programs, or things that work it, it just sits there.

## Post 225 by season (the invisible soul) on Saturday, 07-Jun-2014 21:10:52

It depends on how you upgrade your ram. If you already got 8gb on it, then its not that expensive. If you got say, 4gb of ram, and you need to get another 3 4gb ram sticks, it can be a touch more. Again, it definitely coming down in price. you can quite comfortablely get around it with around $100 or even less.
I believe Intel processor got updated at least ones a year, with of course, some minor differ in models in between the major upgrade.

## Post 226 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Sunday, 08-Jun-2014 7:27:06

Getting back to Tif's question:
I think somewhere she mentioned that she tried pressing Windows plus Enter to turn on narrator. Have you tried Windows plus U?
Nathan.

## Post 227 by forereel (Just posting.) on Sunday, 08-Jun-2014 15:52:59

I don't think she's received the computer yet, so hasn't had a chance to try anything at all.
I do think it be best for her to have her helper handy in case she runs in to difficults. My reason for this, is she says they are not vary interested, or computer savy, so if they watch her as she's doing her upgrade, she can receive assistants right there.
If you fail the first time, the system goes back to windows 8, so she'd need to start over.
Seems more time effective.

## Post 228 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Sunday, 08-Jun-2014 23:03:56

Agreed.

## Post 229 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Monday, 09-Jun-2014 17:05:05

Joanie said that my computer is now running Windows 8.1, but I will check it when I get it, just to make sure. I don't know if it's the updated version or not, as she said that it couldn't find any updates. But she did go to the store and download 8.1.
Regardless, I just learned a few very disturbing things.
1. There is some kind of inaccessible lock screen that I must now disable. Thankfully, I learned how to do this here. But if I do encounter it, how can I temporarily bypass it so that I can implement these steps?
http://www.askvg.com/how-to-disable-lock-screen-in-windows-8/
2. I have to sign in with a username and password every time I start my computer. Again, I found a way to stop this, but it really is ridiculous, as is that lock screen. I could understand using it if you have multiple accounts, but not when only one exists on the machine.
http://www.cnet.com/how-to/five-essential-windows-8-1-time-saving-tweaks/
Speaking of accounts, everyone keeps talking about the necessity of having a Microsoft account. Must I create one?

## Post 230 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Monday, 09-Jun-2014 17:41:12

No, you don't need to create a Microsoft account, the only benefit in creating one is that you can sink apps between devices, and if you forget your password, you can reset it online, that is for your computer. I'm not even sure how to get the update either. How do you check to see if the most recent update is installed?
Nathan. Will you lose any files?

## Post 231 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Monday, 09-Jun-2014 17:44:43

Okay. She rebooted and said that the computer automatically asks for a password, as I had thought. Will NVDA read this screen? If not, then do I just write the password and press enter for things to start? She didn't say anything about a lock screen, but maybe, that's because this is the first reboot. For now, I'll just try to keep the computer on, until I can make the necessary changes. I'll be picking it up tomorrow, regardless of whether she follows the steps in the above links or not.

## Post 232 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Monday, 09-Jun-2014 17:58:10

Yes, NVDA should read this screen. The lock screen is for locking your computer, so you shouldn't have to worry about that.
Nathan.

## Post 233 by forereel (Just posting.) on Monday, 09-Jun-2014 20:42:22

That lock screen has several reasons for being. You should really go read Microsofts page about Windows 8/8.1 and 8.1.1
It is perfectly accessible.
You can set your computer up on a local account instead of the Microsoft account and choose not to have a password, so you just hit enter on it when asked.
Or make the pass blank.
All the settings you have are actually benefitual, trust me on this.
Windows 8.1.1 is nothing more than an automatic update, so if you need it, you'll get it, so don't worry about that.

## Post 234 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 10-Jun-2014 1:37:48

I found an excellent tutorial for Windows 8 here. It's from 2012, so is not for 8.1, of course, but I really like the no-nonsense style and demonstrations. If nothing else, it should help me get started.
http://www.accessibleworld.org/content/accessible-world-tek-talk-presents-rick-harmon-windows-8

## Post 235 by dallas cowboy fanc (Veteran Zoner) on Tuesday, 10-Jun-2014 5:13:40

The korean guy on nvda is good . Tiff my dell cheap laptop with i3 2.4 dual with 8 gig
ram running win 7 is at the dell shop for repair after 6 months. Learn 8.1 and teach me.

## Post 236 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 10-Jun-2014 19:51:30

Considering my experiences in the last two hours or so, I just may! I seriously can't believe that I'm saying this, but so far, I really like Windows 8.1 far better than 7! I was able to install NVDA and several other programs as well as my documents and music, and to create shortcuts to all of them on my desktop! I didn't have to deal with the permissions that drove me mad on 7. I'm installing a few extra things with Ninite, including the all-important Firefox, so for the moment, I'm still on my old machine. Anyway, I don't even have to deal with the start screen and the apps. I just hit windows-m and get straight to the desktop. The only thing that I need to do now is to install Greek as an input language. I started and then hit cancel, since I wanted to ensure that it would install only the input and not change my display settings. But now, I can't find the download language pack. That could be because I manually set the display to English. I'll have to try switching the keyboard layout. I also need to see whether this is monotonic or polytonic, since I didn't see the option for the latter. Normally, I wouldn't need it, but I'm in the progress of working with a wonderful man to get ESpeak to read polytonic, which it can now do! He just needs to put a few finishing touches on it, and I need to be able to write in it to help him.
At any rate, there is one very serious problem that I'm noticing and I really hope it will be easy to solve. The volume of the speech keeps changing. I noticed this with both Narrator and NVDA. It reminds me of someone turning up the volume on a radio. So the first word of a sentence is very quiet, and as more words are read, it gets louder until the volume normalises. If I use it continuously, the speech usually stays constant. But even then, it has stopped and then returned a few times. If I leave the keyboard for awhile and then start typing, it repeats that same cycle of quiet to normal. But this doesn't happen when I'm listening to music. There is a setting in the control panel about communication devices and changing volume when they're detected but I unchecked that. This is very annoying, so if anyone can help me, I would sincerely appreciate it.
Finally, I'm still trying to figure out the passwords issue, though I don't think it will be a serious problem now. Apparently, when the computer starts, I just need to press the applications key and then enter my password. I read that if I hit alt-r and then type "control user passwords2" (minus the quotes) and enter, I should see a dialogue where I can uncheck a box, write in my password and have the computer start normally. But when I tried it, nothing happened. It just sent me back to the desktop.

## Post 237 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Tuesday, 10-Jun-2014 19:52:50

Oh yes. I've seen a few tool tips. Basically, notifications informing me of things or asking me what to do in certain situations. How do I get to them with NVDA or System Access?

## Post 238 by forereel (Just posting.) on Tuesday, 10-Jun-2014 21:56:57

On the password, simple press the arrow key down and you'll be in the right place.
I don't know how NVDA behaves, but that is all I need do with Jaws, or most times just type it.
The only other thing on the volume is it is probably set to effects on, and that be the default setting. If you turn the effects off, it will probably solve that.
Now, how does the box perform?

## Post 239 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 11-Jun-2014 0:52:20

It worked! Now my speech is at a constant volume! I really can't complain about the performance of the machine. It loads webpages in a very acceptable amount of time, plays Youtube videos without any choppiness in sound, and I have now installed Greek, so can easily switch between languages when necessary. The only thing to which I'm still adjusting is the keyboard. I went from using an IBM Model M from 1989, with large, full profile clicky keys, to a small keyboard with very low profile ones and a tiny right shift key. I'm also not sure what they mean by chicklet keys and these not being flat. They're certainly not curved like on a Model M, and I can't see how they can see these are not flat. But really, these are very minor complaints. So far, I'm very happy with my purchase.

## Post 240 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 11-Jun-2014 14:10:22

You don't need that feature enabled. It is for persons with mobility or hand problems.
Sure, it works if it was honestly new and set up correctly.
Just like your other computer. I swear, proper setup makes a difference.

## Post 241 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 11-Jun-2014 14:50:01

To which feature are you referring? I don't see how sound effects are useful to someone with the use of only one hand, so I suppose I'm missing something. As for my other computer, I'm assuming you mean my Elitebook? That ws a nice machine, but too large and heavy for my needs in a portable. This one is just the right size and weight for using outside, in the car (when on holiday), etc.

## Post 242 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 11-Jun-2014 15:25:52

That isn't a sound effects setting.
The computer I'm talking about was the one you got with Windows 7 installed that started this whole board "problems with Windows 7." Smile.
I argued that that computer wasn't properly setup, and I still argue that with a proper install of Windows 7 on it, it have been okay, provided, it didn't have machanical issues.

## Post 243 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Wednesday, 11-Jun-2014 15:53:32

Oddly enough, when Lee tried to reinstall Windows 7 from the recovery partition, it was corrupt.

## Post 244 by forereel (Just posting.) on Wednesday, 11-Jun-2014 20:27:43

So send it to Forereel! I'll uncorrupt it!

## Post 245 by blbobby (Ooo you're gona like this!) on Thursday, 12-Jun-2014 13:48:16

Hey, I have hand problems.
Is there something I could do in 7 to help?
I don't want a screen magnifier, or an on screen keyboard, or narrator. What else is there?
Bob

## Post 246 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Thursday, 12-Jun-2014 13:53:49

I never really looked into this, but they might have speech recognition. If not, then you may be able to find a program for it that's free or decently priced. But if you use a screen reader, they may or may not be able to work together.

## Post 247 by LeoGuardian (You mean there is something outside of this room with my computer in it?) on Thursday, 12-Jun-2014 14:55:25

Speech recognition works ok in Windows 7 if you are in normal edit windows like your emails and stuff.
I had a staff infection in my hand last year and so they said not to type with it, not like I could have with it all wrapped up, but I did quite a bit using Speech Recognition. While it is not as good as dictation on the iPhone, it does work.
The tutorial for setting it up is pretty easy also. Just type speech recognition in the search box of the start menu, and it will get you started working with it.

## Post 248 by forereel (Just posting.) on Thursday, 12-Jun-2014 19:06:33

I believe Bob was teasing people? Smile.

## Post 249 by hardyboy09 (I'm going for the prolific poster awards!) on Friday, 13-Jun-2014 7:01:41

Glad you're happy with your new machine! I like my setup too, but still trying to get 5.1 to work, and going to purchase a UPS next month for all my components to be safe from lightning.
Nathan.

## Post 250 by blbobby (Ooo you're gona like this!) on Saturday, 14-Jun-2014 6:26:42

No Wayne, unfortunately I wasn't teasing.
It takes me about five minutes to write a message like this: and I hate it.
I may check out the speech recognition, but I heard it doesn't do well with jaws. (lol, your computer talks to itself!)
Bob

## Post 251 by Eleni21 (I have proven to myself and the world that I need mental help) on Saturday, 14-Jun-2014 15:14:05

Why not just use headphones, so that the microphone doesn't pick up JFW speaking?
At any rate, I have an update on my machine. For experimental purposes, I opened several Wordpad and Jarte documents, including one of the entire Iliad and another of a large grammar book. Plus, I was in a Skype voice chat, while watching a video on Youtube, and had several instances of Firefox open, all symultaneously. Everything worked perfectly! So I must revise my comments from acceptable on the internet to truly wonderful! Even when it's been on all day, it doesn't slow down as I have seen other machines do in the past. Perhaps, this will change as I use it more, but for now, I can't complain. I'm honestly not sure why everyone kept telling me that this computer wouldn't be good for me.

## Post 252 by forereel (Just posting.) on Saturday, 14-Jun-2014 19:33:22

If you remember I never said that. I said it be better then a netbook, and if a netbook served you well, it serve you better.
Next it's new, so new machines don't get slower the longer you have them on.
Bob, try the sticky keys option.

## Post 253 by blbobby (Ooo you're gona like this!) on Saturday, 14-Jun-2014 21:02:08

Sticky keys. Good idea, I've seen it but never tried it.
Thanks.
Tif, congratz. Perseverance is indeed a virtue.
Bob

## Post 254 by JH_Radio (I've now got the silver prolific poster award! wahoo!) on Sunday, 15-Jun-2014 17:40:03

I guess the thing is, if you ever use it for anything more then basic tasks, t it'll b be slow or not be able to do said taks at all well. glad it works for you.